Dark Jedi vs Sith

[Xi'Aberron Qun]

[member="Valiens Nantaris"] [member="Romeo Sin"] [member="Spencer Jacobs"] [member="Sarge Potteiger"] [member="Qae Shena"] [member="Gerion Ardik"] [member="Darth Vornskr"] [member="Lily Kirsche Kuhn"] [member="Beowoof"] [member="Lisa Ticon"]


Okay, so I came across a discussion about whether or not the Dark Jedi came before the Sith in another thread, Sarge's Guide to The Force and its Users, and I just though "Hey, some of this makes no sense at all!" You know, what with some people calling the Dark Jedi merely Sith who do not adhere to the Sith religion/practice.

Now, as Sarge Potteiger said, and Tefka reinforced,

If you wish to debate the fact that Dark Jedi and Sith are/are not the same thing, I kindly suggest you take it elsewhere.

, and because I did not find the "Elsewhere" , I'm bringing it up here.


(And I really hope I am not bothering any of you with this, but I was curious and couldn't help myself.)

So.

My views on the subject are as follows: the Dark Jedi is a term to describe any force wielder who is not bound to an organisation like the One Sith, at which point they are known as a Sith, but they do not stop being Dark Jedi.

They simply gain another title.

A Dark Jedi, in my opinion is any Force-wielder who uses only the Dark Side of the Force, just like a Grey Jedi is someone who uses both sides in Balance, and a Jedi is someone who uses only the Light Side of the Force. Now bear in mind that these are only the commonly used terms, and not the ancient ones that may or may not be listed in the books/canon/etc.

The Sith were a race of Dark-Sided Force-Sensitive beings that started on the planet of Korriban and eventually spread throughout the galaxy, their usage of the Dark Side of the Force was so dominant that their name became the title to describe most Dark-Sided Force-users, at which point the organisation/empire known as the Sith was born.

Anyone who uses only the Dark Side of the Force is a Dark Jedi, but only those who join the Sith Order are actually Sith.

Following this logic, the Dark Jedi came before the Sith, albeit with a different name, even if simply because you cannot have a Sith without using the Dark Side of the Force, which makes you a Dark Jedi.

Another example would be that the wiki ( http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Sith_(species)) states that the Rakatans came before the Sith, leading them for a bit and introducing them to the galactic stage before attempting to enslave them, which shows that Dark-Side Force-users came before the Sith as an organisation was even thought of.

Dark Jedi, in my opinion is simply a blanket term, whereas Sith is a title given for participation in a certain order.

Your thoughts?

 

[Allyson Locke]

I feel like this has been discussed so many times and everyone needs to agree to disagree. The concept of a "dark Jedi" IMO is up to the person who is the Dark Jedi or possibly another name for someone who is neutral.

 

[Aithne Charr]

Spencer's answer is honestly the one with the most... validity to it. You could be literal about it where you use the Darkside to achieve a similar goal to a Jedi. You can take it as a Jedi that has fallen to their power and is consumed by it. Or you can just take it as some random darksider that is not sith. The point is Dark Jedi is such a wide range of things that its hard to have a set definition.

 

[Ellie Mors]

Wasn't that thread from 6 months ago?

 

[Valiens Nantaris]

I'm not sure why I was tagged.

It is whatever you want it to be. There's a Legends canon definition and there's whatever you think. We're not going to ram a definition down your throat unless it becomes something which breaks the board rules.

 

[Fabula Caromed]

"Are the Jedi the evil ones?"
"What's the difference between Jedi/Rogue Jedi/Dark Jedi/Sith?"
"Is there really a Dark Side of the Force?"

We've had these discussions staggeringly frequently.

 

[Siobhan Kerrigan]

After all the times this has been discussed...I don't see a reason for yet another thread...


Anyhow, what Spencer and the scruffy Scotchman said.

 

[Xi'Aberron Qun]

We've had these discussions staggeringly frequently.

Well, the fact that they have occured so frequently means that they have never been resolved, which was what I was trying to do here.

And I tagged everyone I did because I just went through the posts on Sarge Potteiger's thread and tagged all of those who I thought had an opinion to add to this.

But if you honestly just want to leave it as an "it's whatever the hell you want it to be", then okay.

 

[Jorus Merrill]

In canon, the definition varies by viewpoint character and era. Wookieepedia is pretty clear that it's a catchall category. My personal favorite definition is that a Dark Jedi is anyone who:

*Uses the Dark Side AND
*Has training in the 'Jedi arts' - generally lightsabre and core powers AND
*Has not had significant training in Sith abilities (and, to a lesser extent, traditions/philosophies) AND
*Is not part of another Force tradition, such as the Nightsisters

That's the Clone Wars-era definition, so far as Sidious, Dooku, Ventress et al were concerned. Far from the only definition, but the one I find the most useful.

 

[Allyson Locke]

But if you honestly just want to leave it as an "it's whatever the hell you want it to be", then okay.

That's exactly what's being said. Also this conversation has been talked about numerous times. I'd like to stop beating a dead horse lol.

 

[Ashin Varanin]

Tangentially relevant:

 

[Boggo Flib]

dark jedi are cooler.

 

[Valiens Nantaris]

never been resolved, which was what I was trying to do here.

It's something which cannot be resolved. You clearly believe something different from most others here and are sticking by it, same for them.

Discussion is fine, but hold no illusions that this will be the Council of Nicea which resolves all.

 

[Darth Carnifex]

I prefer the Council of Nikaea.

[member="Valiens Nantaris"]

 

[Valiens Nantaris]

[member="Darth Vornskr"]
-_-
I will my Anglicised spellings or nothing.

 

[Xi'Aberron Qun]

I don't see a reason for yet another thread...

Also this conversation has been talked about numerous times.

Would you mind letting me know which threads these are that you are talking about?

Because I went and looked, and I didn't find a single thread that dealt specifically with the differences between the Dark Jedi and the Sith. I found numerous things about "Jedi are the true evil" and "Jedi vs Sith", but no "Which came first, Dark Jedi or Sith?" Or even a "Dark Jedi and Sith, and why they are different."

If I had found something like that in an actual thread like this that is easily accessible with a bit of looking, then I would not have started this thread, but I didn't.

So please: tell me where these discussions were so that I may look at them.

 

[Jor Kvall]

It's quite simple really, and there is no reason why there should be any discrepancy over this. The definition is made quite clear throughout much of the EU.

Dark Jedi is a catch-all term for any person who uses the Dark Side but does not belong to a specific cult like the Sith. End of story.

So you would be correct in stating that a Sith could also be called a "Dark Jedi" - as a blanket term.

Oh, and hi.

 

[Xi'Aberron Qun]

[member="Sten Kvall"]

Thank you!

But it would seem that many others do not agree with that...

Hi to you as well!

 

[Jor Kvall]

But it would seem that many others do not agree with that...

Then they would be incorrect.

 

[Valiens Nantaris]

Well now, let's not go bandying around universal truth, shall we?