Too Many Masters In The Kitchen

[Flannigan Mcnash]

It's a problem with most role-play in general, espcially coming off the coat-tails of more established table top RPGs, such as D&D and the Star Wars RPG. In those you're the main character in that it's your story and your the hero, but in communial role-play were numbers exceed the single digits it's not your story, you aren't special you're one in a million and you ain't Luke skywalker or Darth-Vader, cause if everyone is no one is, it's the common pop and it's chump change, an unrewarding seeing those characters.

The plane and simple characters the stormtrooper, the cantina thug, those are the new special and for good reason. Not all can be force gods, and even Jedi masters weren't Obi-wans, he was rare and far between and ontop of that he was a main character, we just need to tone it down. From the broody Sith and their orphane fetish, to the Jedi and their master padwans, anyone can train to be the best but it takes a really good role-player to limit themselves. But this isn't a shot at any one group, NFUs can make all these mistakes minus the force, we shoud all be moduled around [member="Jaret Sha'Co"], this padgy bugger couldn't even lift a rock, and for all the master padwans this man is diamond in the rough. Or atleast moduled around him in their infancy, all I'm saying is don't be a bastard and don't throw mountains at people.

 

[Valiens Nantaris]

[member="Flannigan Mcnash"]
Okay.

So let’s for a moment assume this is something which was perceived as a clear issue – though I know it’s not for most people.

What would be the solution? SWRP has a lot of Masters relatively but there’s two things to consider here:

• PC characters are the cream, the elite of the galaxy. With this in mind, they represent 99% of all the Master level characters in the galaxy. In a galaxy of untold trillions, is that unreasonable, especially if you look at it through the prism of the Old Republic rather than the original trilogy.
• People work for their ranks. Whether they transfer in or they work for them, every Master on this board has been passed either by the admins or the RPJs to maintain a level of work and dedication.

I understand your point about padawans doing things perhaps they shouldn’t. However, I’ve genuinely seen very few times where it’s been a problem. Where it has, a quick edit is requested and matters return to normal.

I’m not sure what you would suggest be done about it without either putting caps on how many characters of a rank a writer can have (which is bad) or introducing a bureaucracy of Force powers like other sites too (which is even worse).

So…yeah, not sure what to say.

 

[Josh Dragovalor]

Should be up to the writer on if they should limit their characters or not. I'm one of the people who does it. I earned my way to Masterhood, but still limit my characters "power" of sorts. But that's my choice. I do it because I want to, as part of my characters development.

Godawans doing Master level things... Yeah. Bad. But they're usually dealt with.

 

[Quinn]

[member="Flannigan Mcnash"]

*shakes head*

How many times have I, and the others, told you that if you run into a godawan that you should hit them up with a message and explain the situation, then from there if they refuse to cooperate, hit that report button yo.

 

[Jsc]

Us versus them, is not real. This problem is an illusion. Only we in our infancy make it so.

Every RP can be tailored to suit the needs of the writers and the adventure. There is no spoon. No power or metal prowess. All is imagination. The idea that a single character's prowess exists as a tangible finite measurable-thing-a-ma-bob within some sort of stagnate shared metaverse is just a single perspective. Only one way to see through a looking glass darkly. A tiny, and I would argue insignificant, perspective that easily dissolves within our communities ever expanding tide of raw flame and imagination. The domain of the shared creation is not one of comparison, us versus them, but of alchemical change. Conforming to the demands of the will of the writers that shape them. Always shifting. Always rising and falling. Always at risk. Dangerous and calm. Power like soft putty in the hands of it's writers. Oh no. To say: I am greater than they, is the power only to fool oneself. Sorrowfully. It is a truth every veteran writer soon learns. Whether they want to or not. That their character is a fiction. An fiction with just as much merit as the next one. And the next one. And the next one beyond that. Indeed. If Tef could remove the Rank Titles completely, he most arguably would. All characters being made equal in the eyes of their creators. Some Lords and some Ladies. Some humble and some small. All fiction and imagination.

Us versus them, is not real. Not here. It never was. Only we make it so.

 

[Laira Darkhold]

Not a fan of General Mountain, huh.

Spoiler

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yE0Rtq-9eJM

I can see how FU's are demigods (They are) and I can see how as an NFU it seems like an insurmountable obstacle.
Remember this, in reference to what Valiens said, every PC is the cream of the crop

• Boba Fett went toe to toe with Vader and hurt him enough to earn his respect
• General Greivous killed scores of Jedi (Albeit with Cyborg Superpowers)
• Jango Fett just shot a Jedi to death (AOTC Arena Battle) and gave Obi-Wan a lesson in pain (Winning their duel in my opinion)
• Plus random clones killed hundreds of Jedi during Order 66

What it comes down to is be creative with tactics/weapons/gear and if someone decides that they are all powerful Force GodOdinZeusRa that

you should hit them up with a message and explain the situation, then from there if they refuse to cooperate, hit that report button yo.

 

[Darth Ferus]

Just hit em with a force breaker.

No matter who it is, without the force any master is chump change. Or just like you if they actually had other training, and that's pretty rare.

 

[Flannigan Mcnash]

[member="Valiens Nantaris"], there's no solution for it nor am I proposing one. It's just a simple reminder, don't be a bastard.

[member="Jay Scott Clark"], well Shakespear, as much as the ever expanding universe and that there is no cosmic spoon, or equality thing..

Don't be a bastard​

 

[Valiens Nantaris]

[member="Flannigan Mcnash"]
A…tad harsh. I'll ask you not to use that language to other members.

Considering you never actually made the point of this thread clear I thought you were saying it was a problem which needed fixing.

So…yeah.

 

[Jsc]

Don't be a bastard

 

[Grrwunhoooll Agaburry]

any NFU can own a Force user

 

[Fabula Caromed]

Might I present you with [member="Triam Akovin"], who has kicked the butts of a not insubstantial portion of the master population on this board. Nothing but tricks, grit, and skill. No special superhuman abilities, no bullcrap Epicanthix immunity. Just a human with a gun, who seems to be extraordinarily gifted at kicking FU arse.

And she's just one of a long list of NFUs who make a routine habit of taking psychic space laser ninja demigods and spanking them silly.

 

[Keira Priest]

I would say that it all depends on who you're writing with and whether they're fair or not. Personally, I've not run into much issue with all powerful FUs on the site. There will always be those few, but in my opinion they're never the majority. In all of the threads I've personally been in where I have a character fighting a FU, no matter their rank or supposed skill set, things have always been fairly witten. But I can understand your frustration when they aren't, and as everyone else has said, when that happens it's best to take things to a PM, because that's one of the only ways you'll be able to change your experience for the better.

Will there always be a few bad apples? Most definitely. But here on Chaos I'd say we have very few, if indeed there are any at all. I've seen plenty of NFUs beat FUs on this site, and it's happened to my characters a few times as well. ([member="Vilaz Munin"]). It all boils down to who you're threading with, and that's where the problem begins and ends.

[member="Flannigan Mcnash"]

 

[Ashin Varanin]

Hi.

I am probably, in the eyes of some, emblematic of the problem. I've worked five characters up to Master level (those that're still alive, anyway; I've played easily a dozen Masters at one point or another). My main, Ashin Varanin, has been around for hundreds upon hundreds of threads, gone toe-to-toe with Emperors and Grandmasters, created Force Storms, and beat the crap out of many, many Master-level PCs who thought they were snowflakes.

Welp, Ashin has also tangled with NFUs of every description, and hasn't always done so well. Notably, [member="Triam Akovin"] defeated her with a couple of gadgets and guns. Other NFUs have seriously injured Ashin at various points. My other characters have gotten the crap kicked out of them many times -- Jorus, Rave, Shule, everyone. I've had more Masters killed in PVP than most writers have ever written. I've been doing serious PVP for over a decade, and here's something I learned:

People who whine and accuse and get defiant and try to stake out some kind of moral high ground when their characters are at a disadvantage -- those people don't get taken seriously, and they don't have what it takes to win.

People who accept the disadvantage and roll with it, without getting petty or cheap -- those people often end up punching above their weight.

The people you're talking about, oh Original Poster? The people who never take a hit, talk a big game, write five high-handed paragraphs and ten moves a post, and invent powers to make themselves unstoppable? Play your cards right and it's possible to thrash them regardless, if that's what you're into. In my misspent youth I derived a good deal of joy from shredding godmoders and Force Gods, preferably using original trilogy powers or at least a very specific skillset, and minimizing high-handedness. If victory's what you dig, victory is often achievable, within the bounds of fairness. I once saw [member="Tyger Tyger"] take down a Master-level pyrokinetic with an E-11 and a pump-action shotgun. Heck, I once took down a Master as an NFU, using a grappling hook and a shuriken. And I kid you not, I once saw an NFU beat a Grandmaster-level combat specialist using a blaster rifle, a set of brass knuckles, and a nearby balcony.

The time you spend whining about Force Gods is time that you don't spend thinking about how to win regardless of the disadvantage.

Worst-case scenario: they look like godmoders, you look like a straight shooter for taking hits and losing with class, people respect your character more and theirs less, your relative power rises. Wash, rinse, repeat, dominate.

I'm really channeling my teenage PVP-addict self here, lol, but I hope I'm getting the point across.

 

[Valiens Nantaris]

[member="Adalric Vastor"]
You're the reason everything is wrong with everything!

 

[Ashin Varanin]

[member="Valiens Nantaris"]
Au contraire. I am not responsible for your hair.

 

[Kiber Dorn]

Personally, I don't have a competitive bone in my body, and I just tend to stick to people I can trust to be decent with me and who I can be a decent human being with.

One narrow view, but it's my narrow view.

 

[Valiens Nantaris]

[member="Kiber Dorn"]
Shh you, and go back to killing your Masters.

Seriously though, Kiber's writer is the very best fair playing, willing to take a hit RPer I've ever known.

If everyone was like them we really would have no masters left!

 

[Hailyn]

even Jedi masters weren't Obi-wans

I really do not understand this comparison, Obi-Wan was not considered the best, or close to it, even for his time period. From what I've read and seen in the movies, it was only that he was in the right places, or wrong depending on the situation, at the right, or again wrong, times that things happened the way they did. Going so far as to look at the original trilogy alone, the only reason he was looked to be so amazing was that he was a Jedi Knight.

Not to say he wasn't anything special, as he was a Jedi Master, meaning he had to be recognized by the council as such, but then again they were essentially at their weakest during the fall of the Republic and Rise of the Empire eras, so there wasn't much to be compared too, aside from Yoda and Windu, the former of whom was seriously weakened due to the illness that killed him when Luke met him while the latter died after being used as a puppet by Sidious to trick Anakin/Vader. In reality, he was more or less the norm for Jedi as far as masters who were more than honorary titles went.

During Obi-Wan's backstory novels, which are to-date the only novels I have read of star wars outside of Bane and Exar Kun's stories, it was explicitly explained that he was less-than-proficient with the force and his former signature style, as trained by Qui-Gon, was lacking in more ways than one. I mean, sure, he defeated Darth Maul, but you could very well say he was exhausted after dueling a Master and his Padawan for an extremely long time (saber duels involving Juyo and Ataru shouldn't last long at all, as they were both physically taxing).

 

[Kiber Dorn]

[member="Valiens Nantaris"]

Aw shucks, thanks for saying that!