Star Wars Roleplay: Chaos

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Master Rank and What That Infers

Haven Pryde

Pirate Queen | ODF Marine
That is great, now care to explain the part where "what makes a non-affiliated master"? my meaning is that it looks to me that you listed masters of factions, and I know this might not mean anything to anybody.... but I gotta ask, what if the masters are not affiliated with any faction at all?

(and yea I know confusing)
 
Most of the time, they ARE affiliated with a Faction: they simply become independent or unaffiliated later. That becomes a personal choice.

Yes, that said, we do get those who walk the path of the Independent prior to becoming Masters and are given that title as a reflection of one quality or another, but again, that makes it a 100% OOC promotion: it's only really an IC one if acknowledged by a Faction.
 
Major Faction

Syn

Nimir-ra to Iella, Jedi Shadow
If a master isn't in a faction, then as a neutral or rogue they should strive to be that. Rogues usually follow their own code and ideals be they for good or for ill. Grey masters may be harder. From an ooc perspective... It would be hard for several of the things looked for (contribution, setting a good example ect.) and the question of how they might get noticed or nominated could come up but Seroth I believe did it. He made a 90k story setting a great example to us all of what can be done.

*sees he got ninja'd* *squints eyes*
 
Then what you need to ask yourself is what it means to be a Master: is it the state of being Luke Skywalker and simply 'being' a Master, irrespective of whether anyone thinks of you in that way (Skywalker appointed himself a Jedi Master when the New Jedi Order was still being formed), and thus means that you can be a Master independent of a Faction simply based on some arbitrary set of standards or rules? Or must it be proclaimed formally by your peers within a given Faction or group? I guess, put simply, what are you a Master of?

To be a Sith Lord, you must be a Lord among Sith, able to exert power over others with less power or authority than you. A Jedi Master is a Master of Jedi, thus with authority to speak for the Order and provide instruction to those lower down the hierarchy. Neither state indicates Mastery over the Force or over any inherent set of disciplines: thus, they are Masters because their Factions have rendered them such.

What criteria, then, would be set for an independent Master? Who judges them such? ICly, it would have to be themselves, or a Faction they were part of previously. In the former case, isn't that just rank arrogance?
 

Haven Pryde

Pirate Queen | ODF Marine
I might just be confused here but my train of thought keeps wanting to think you said that unless promoted to master by a faction you have no right to claim to be a master while contributing ICly.
and yea I am just curious since I too am trying to learn more about this, no offense meant by any of this. :D
(I hope I am just confused lol)
 
I'm talking ICly. OOCly, sure, you're welcome to claim the rank of 'Master', but that's because it's bestowed upon you by the peer-approved system we have around here, which doesn't restrict Mastery based on faction allegiance, or absence thereof. But ICly, an independent that hasn't been promoted within a Faction wouldn't really have the right to call themselves a Master, as far as I'm concerned. Their sole justification for doing so would likely be based on power, skill or experience, which alone wouldn't qualify you - they're only a few of the traits required, and speak not to responsibilities, duties or work contributed.

It's like a school bully declaring themselves the School Principal, just because they're stronger than the kids on the playground.
 
Major Faction

Syn

Nimir-ra to Iella, Jedi Shadow
Haven she is talking about the show don't tell approach. Same with history, you can have an entire novel of backstory with everything you have done but that doesn't really matter IC wise. It is what you do currently unless you do a lot of past rps and flesh it out.
 
@[member="Haven Pryde"] Yeah, worth noting that everything I say boils down to my own opinion. I fully expect flame wars, mild disagreement and boisterous argument to the contrary. Means I'm always pleasantly surprised when there isn't any.
 

Haven Pryde

Pirate Queen | ODF Marine
I wasn't trying to start anything, I just wanted to understand more...I apologize if I was being rude or anything, it wasn't intended as that. @[member="Teynara Jeralyr"]
 

Jsc

Disney's Princess
First. Everything Teynara said is golden. She acknowledged the realities of the OOC world we live in. Human error included. Heck, I don't care what Zaiden's question was. That was quality reading. Great stuff man! Woot woot. :D

Second. I've always believed that Mastery meant completion. That you finished something. The End. Like completing Jedi training, getting a Masters Degree, or finishing Ace Pilot School. You gained something powerful. Something you can keep. ...But at the same time it also meant a new beginning. You can now start something new. Move on with your life. Indeed, for me it always meant reaching the top of a mountain. Climbing all the way to the top. Standing at the highest peak of some mortal framework. And now that I have finished the climb and can see clearly with new vision. I gained a new perspective from the highest tier possible. And guess what I now see? I see other mountain tops worth climbing. Other goals worth reaching for. Other cliffs that need scaling and other crags that need conquering. It's like my journey has just begun.

Now. I tend to assume that a RP Character's potential for growth is infinite in scope and impossible in breadth. Potential that stretches out past the horizon and dips low behind the sun. And that is will probably take a thousand lifetimes to achieve it all. Maybe more. So the question always becomes in my mind? What does my character want to achieve before they die. Before this period of mortal progression is shed forever. What sphere of power, responsibility, and contribution do they feel like striving for. Because their little RP life is short. And the galaxy is so darn big. They can never really touch it all. There is no end to stumble upon. Not even a ceiling in sight.

So when it comes to Mastery. Acknowledge and explain the OOC world we write in. But then? ...I would hope that everyone can grasp that our character's journeys never end. Because they are as limitless as our Imaginations. :D
 

Qae Shena

Super Shaper Puppy!
In the case of the wonderful @[member="Seroth Ur-Rahn"] - tagged because you're discussing him, as is polite - he was judged by his faction, that is the Vagrant Fleet, and was voted to the rank of Master not only for his writing skill but his always amenable, approachable and friendly personality, his contributions to his faction on an out-of-character basis, in addition to his outstanding and excellent service to the SWRP community as a Roleplay Judge. Let none fault him for his flawless record - he is a better Master and role-model for this community than many who hold the title, as I believe. A Sum of Lies was the catalyst, not the reason.

Talking of an independent Master, truly, what makes them a Master? In the case of any discipline real-world or fictional, what makes someone a master? I argue that mastery is not the be-all and end-all of knowledge, strength, power or wisdom. No, that would be silly, because there is always something more to learn. I'm going to use the martial arts equivalent, the black belt, for so many Eastern martial arts - the black belt does not signify total knowledge of an art. I can tell you from my own experience that will never be true for any man alive. Instead, it signifies that the holder is able to demonstrate all their basic techniques and their various applications, is wise enough not to follow dogma blindly but knows how and when to ask why, and how to learn and adapt to new concepts within their sphere of influence. Why else are there many tiers of black belts-- indeed, why are there even tiers of Masters, that some can perform rare abilities like Force Storm, and others can not? Being a Master alone is meaningless until you inject meaning into the rank.

That's what this is: how do you be a Master here? Do you just get the rank and automatically become some kind of demi-god who can command the laws of physics? No. The respect is gained by actions, both IC and OOC. You speak purely IC, but in all honesty, for any character of a roleplaying site, it can't just be in-character, because we are also always judged for our out-of-character action. You get respect, and power, for an event. When @[member="Siobhan Kerrigan"] brought down the roof on Roche, the entire board knew at that point that she was the premier telekinetic powerhouse of SWRP. Actions speak louder than words - given that this is a written medium, this statement has so many double meanings, but rings especially true.

Finally, an independent master of the Force would have some kind of peers. Self-learning with the Force is very difficult; there's going to be a mentor involved somewhere, or even an opponent that would make a good yardstick. There's going to be a companion somewhere. You can't roleplay with yourself forever.
 

Qae Shena

Super Shaper Puppy!
Much appreciated, @[member="Kaine Zambrano"] - it really helps I had this discussion out with some folks a couple of weeks ago. Keeps the ducks in line.
 

Jsc

Disney's Princess
Darn good stuff Qae. I'd share that martial arts comparison to anybody.

Now. I'll tangent for a bit and bring up a topic that some people find annoying to talk about. That is, withholding IC Ranks because of perceived OOC repercussions. And I say 'perceived' because this strange activity generally spawns from a spirit of fear, and not a spreadsheet of malicious conduct on the part of the player.

I've heard it said before: "They won't give me Master Rank because of yadda-yadda-yadda." There is the assumption that you're being repressed. Of being punished for not meeting someone's expectations OOC. For not meeting the hidden requirements. Now. I'm really not going to get specific. I'm not going to point fingers. Instead I'm going to say a few words to anybody out there who might be feeling this way. About anything. Knight Rank, Master Rank, Head Mod Kitchen Tipper, ...whatever. Here's my advice to you:

Remember to have fun. Don't get caught up in the thick of thin things. Just keep writing, roleplaying, and having fun. Master Rank will come to you. It's not something you can put a timer on. Not something you can compare yourself to others for. It's not something you need to have a blast on this website. If anything it will raise peoples expectations about you and require you to work harder, imagine greater, and believe stronger. Haha. And if you're worried about PvP? Don't be. Nobody is going to kill your character. I promise.

Moral. Master Rank is great fun. But so is everything else about this site. Party hard and smile often. Haha. Eventually everyone out there will call you, The Writer-yes-you-yourself, ...A Master. :D
 
Call me a very crazy, and I mean very crazy minority here.

Yes, I used to take this super seriously. It was earn that promotion or never feel validated for all the writing I had done for myself, my faction, and to help the board. I can remember all the long hours just busting my tail and hoping that someone would acknowledge all the work I was putting in. Granted, in PVP situations this made me hyper competitive as I didn't want to lose face at all and it made me a rather rude person to deal with on the board. I just knew I was chasing a goal, and nothing was going to stop me, and I truly lost sight of things when it comes to RPing for a while there.

RPing stands for Role PLAYing, and I wasn't having any fun. At it's heart, this is a game that is meant to be truly enjoyed. I keep seeing real world comparisons thrown around, when honestly this is just a game. If you see it as anything more serious than that, your perspective is getting warped pretty bad. Judging on Master promotions to me should be all about judging personality, if they cause trouble, and "work." Those three things are pretty indicative of how I feel about who gets what around on the board(in truth I have zero voting power past the Sith Empire at the faction level.)

So if you play nice, truly strive to help others, and have fun you're aces in my book. I'll never be so pompous as to tell someone their character sucks, or that their story lines and plot-arcs are terrible. Funny thing happens the longer you are around writers, all stories become cliche and nothing is fun. We all tend to forget we started out and were the "noobs" ourselves who had great fun telling the stories we find so overdone these days. This falls back on the word "work" I used earlier.

To me "work" can be someone making over 80 threads and showing substantial character growth and improving on their writing ability. Not all of us are as gifted as others here, and simply don't have the chops to write an 84,000 word epic like @[member="Seroth Ur-Rahn"] did. He did the "work" required for his promotion through numerous other IC threads(he doesn't spam OOC, as a matter of fact his only OOC posts are in the Factory and Staff forum.) Point is, to our hyper active members who post in every thread they can, he might not stick out because he truly is a writer who is telling a story in a few threads right now. IC wise he earned the promotion, as well as OOC. That said, I don't believe everyone is here to write novels, and they truly play the game and have fun. Not everyone will be an amazing writer, but if they are having fun and doing "work," they deserve to be rewarded. To say other wise is just elitist and looks petty when we deny people what they deserve on a message board where it is all a game.

I repeat: this is not the real world nor do real world analogies work for a game.

If anything, this is more akin to a game that is expressed via writing. Some choose to do so via getting from point A-point B and having a blast being in many threads. Others write sprawling epics that make you question why they aren't on Amazon.com under "Best-Sellers." So to @[member="Haven Pryde"] you just keep having fun, be a good example OOC and good things will happen.
 

Matreya

Well-Known Member
O.O everyone thinks I meant for the site...lmao I meant in cannon stories/books/movies what made a master in evsryones opinions

@[member="Darth Ithari"] @[member="Jay Scott Clark"] @[member="Qae Shena"]
However your posts are all great so thanks.
 

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