Banned Species List Updated

[Fatty]

[member="Tefka"], sorry that it seemed I screamed unfair, I was attempting to be the advocate for those whom I knew would be upset. It in no way suits me one way or the other whether or not they are banned, but it does go against the general precedent that staff has thus far placed.

Obviously standards change, but this seems radically out of left field with no warning, rhyme, or reason other than, staff and a lot of others don't generally like to see dragons in star wars... however I could argue there is an equal number of people who could whine that they don't like zombies/undead-types in star wars either for example, yet I don't see them being banned any time soon, with their frequent usage around the site for various things. Besides, these things can be ignored, and I've yet to see any dragon character hated on openly.

I could make a long argument, however, in the long run this ruling doesn't effect me. I'm just trying to see why Staff is suddenly making retroactive rules (to note, that last bit wasn't an attack, merely a statement and curiosity), and what's their justification for doing it in this case.

 

[Jsc]

Faenrovon The Radiant is a fun character with loads of LOTR gifs he should totally use more often. Lol. I think I submitted a report once during a Skirmish about the writer's choice of spawn location, (right above my characters head), but never about the character itself or it's species. Haha.

Anyway. I'd love to see a public poll about how much the community likes Dragons though? Canon or otherwise. Somebody should totally go make that. Popular support campaign ftw!

After all. The best way to change or educate any Staff decision is to examine it fairly, see both sides of the coin, your perspective and theirs; and then politely consolidate, build, polish, and submit a public portfolio of new ideas and solutions to them with humility and encouragement.

The whole p/a mob agenda thing... Meh. It's so last year.

 

[Not Ordo]

Does this mean [member="Faenrovon The Radiant"] and I can mate and have Dragon/Leviathan babies?

 

[Fatty]

[member="Dralshy'a"] That was... out of left field... lol

 

[War Hydra]

[member="Dralshy'a"]

You and me baby, ain't nothing but 'Zillas. Lets do it like they do on the Discovery Channel.

 

[Lira Dajenn]

So you're saying theres a chance for my Arkanianstaryammoskzillocelestial?

 

[Ayden Cater]

Simply put, dragons are not Star Wars-y. Star Wars is predominately a Sci-Fi setting. This means there's a lot of technology around. Things like starships and lasers are abundant. Limbs are hacked off and replaced with the greatest of ease. Whole systems have been constructed through the technological prowess of a species. And Dragons.... aren't like any of those hting. More to the point, Dragons are all but long extinct. As well, the few dragon-like species that remain around are tend to besmall, relatively harmless, and (this is important here) non sentient. Some might be semi-sentient. But no dragon is full sentient and self-aware like a Human or a Twi'lek. This means they do not talk. They do not have cognizant thoughts and feelings. They don't make suggestions and they don't listen to orders. Yet people are making these creatures with massive size, fully articulate thoughts and speech, capable of using the Force and were flying around like it was no big deal.

It's the same as walking through a fantasy world like Skyrim or Middle Earth, and suddenly a guy on a motorcycle with a machine gun comes speeding by and puts three rounds in Saruman's chest. It doesn't "fit" within the setting. Dragons just don't fit within Star Wars. Not as intelligent, Force-Using, 50 meter long beings capable of rational thought and speech.

 

[Saki]

Ah aren't the Stardragons (cause I can't say their real name) sages and monks most of the time? And found it http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Duinuogwuin now if two of them mated they produced unintelligent offspring.

 

[Olivia Dem'adas]

Like... I'm not even mad about this personally. I retired this character when the Horde ignored by advice and did what I asked them not to do. And I only ever made it to help them. I was actually considering whether I should delete the character or change the name and make a whole new character... And War Hydra... I made when I was scouting out the site and deciding what I wanted to roleplay as. He's a 'custom species' that I plan on subbing one day when I have the time and the muse for a development thread..... But I neither use nor roleplay with either character so I don't care about this from a personal standpoint.

I just feel that it's kinda mean to just point at a cluster of characters and say "We don't want your kind here. Go do something else."

When the rules change in the factory, the old stuff is grandfathered in until it becomes a problem. Partially to prevent butt-hurt and partially because the Judges would have to go through and review, edit, and re-review every previous sub. But with this... It's fully on the effected writers and nobody else. It doesn't effect the judges or the staff. I feel that if you're going to do this, you should take the initiative to reach out to the effected writers/characters and work with them to create new and acceptable species subs for their characters.

 

[Garza]

Venom and Spider man (with the alien suit) are now sad

The Mnggal-Mnggal are sad as well

 

[Valiens Nantaris]

Ah, so this is today's

 

[Tefka]

but it does go against the general precedent that staff has thus far placed.

Precedents are meant to be changed, just like rules. I tell my fellow Staff members this all the time. Just because a precedent is there does not mean we will follow it. It's a hindrance to making fair rulings.

'm just trying to see why Staff is suddenly making retroactive rules (to note, that last bit wasn't an attack, merely a statement and curiosity), and what's their justification for doing it in this case.

I'll address all species banned, even though people seem to only care about dragons.

1. These were among the most popular choices chosen for banishment by the Factory Judges. I chose to execute their decision.

2. Mnngal-Mnngal is a hive mind and cannot be represented by one person. I view Mnngal-Mnngal like I view Omni: As it can be escalated to almost Celestial-like powers, the classification of the species should be that of a Superweapon and reserved only for Staff-ran or Staff-approved events.

3. Yammosks are War Coordinators and have never truly been depicted as having sentience. Even the wiki says they're only partially sentient. They're tools, used by the Yuuzhan Vong. No more.

4. Dragons. Many of the Factory Judges hold that they're overpowered, played by power gamers, and most of them are classified as either non-sentient or semi-sentient. My personal reason for including them in this very short list? They belong in a Fantasy setting. Not Star Wars. I have no trouble with them being in a Fantasy setting, but they don't give the slightest Star Wars vibe when I see them in threads. The only depiction in canon we have of dragons is the bones of a Krayt dragon. Clearly not a playable character. Merely just a setting piece.

My personal opinion is, we should ban all non-sentient or semi-sentient species from being player characters. But that's not the ruling here. The ruling is Yammosks, Dragons, and Mnngal-Mnngal.

 

[Fatty]

My personal opinion is, we should ban all non-sentient or semi-sentient species from being player characters.

In my personal opinion, that would be a great idea... if only I was not so bugged by the retroactive bit. Over all though, it seems the general consensus from the people I am defending is that they in general, don't care too much about it. But my points stand, in the name that I don't like retro-activity, as it doesn't allow what was going on to finish through, it just... ends. A limited grandfather, such as allowing them to be, but give them a limited amount of time to adjust, would be much more acceptable in my opinion, and would reduce the over all butt-hurt for being dropped a bomb that says they need to stop being "x" because of "y", I don't care how much you like "x".

That's just my way of seeing though.

 

[Ayden Cater]

The ruling is Yammosks, Dragons, and Mnngal-Mnngal.

Until such a time as adequate reason is given to expand it.

There are a lot of other things we could probably safely add to the list, but our goal is not to slash creativity. It's to help promote a healthy community. When people approach potential problems with a sense of maturity and respect, not just for themselves but for others, when people say "I want to be X because it would be an interesting story" and not "I want to be X because then I can beat up other people in Invasions", then things like this aren't needed.

Just because something -can- be done, because it is not expressly forbidden by the rules, does not mean it -should- be done. If you're looking to do something or make a new character whose sole goal is to screw someone else over, it's probably a bad idea.

The above were added to the list because there was adequate reason to. There might be something else that we could throw on there and then someone makes it into a character down the line. They might make problems and we might have to add it to the list. But hopefully they would tread with respect and dignity and we wouldn't have to.

 

[Lord Ghoul]

 

[Jorus Merrill]

Dragon people, I have a solution for you:

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Tailring

 

[The Hound]

EH. Go ahead. No one will miss them in a few weeks.

 

[Onrai]

"2. Mnngal-Mnngal is a hive mind and cannot be represented by one person. I view Mnngal-Mnngal like I view Omni: As it can be escalated to almost Celestial-like powers, the classification of the species should be that of a Superweapon and reserved only for Staff-ran or Staff-approved events."

This implies that Mnggal-Mnggal is actually capable of creating technology rivaling the Celestials(which of course is the only main reason they're on the banned list, considering we have no idea how strong they /actually/ were with regards to the Force, and many individuals have done things comparable to, if not surpassing what they did). Mnggal-Mnggal cannot create technology. It can only use it, typically through infecting people or through using blob-like tendrils. Mnggal-Mnggal is vulnerable to acid, fire, ice, and other "effect damage" weapons. Assuming its similarity to the Dark Harvest virus, it can also be encased in in edible material such as biofiber to prevent it from spreading. And while the hive mind theory seems to suit them, individual units still seem to exhibit a sense of self-identity.

 

[Judah Dashiell]

Obviously standards change, but this seems radically out of left field with no warning, rhyme, or reason other than, staff and a lot of others don't generally like to see dragons in star wars... however I could argue there is an equal number of people who could whine that they don't like zombies/undead-types in star wars either for example, yet I don't see them being banned any time soon, with their frequent usage around the site for various things. Besides, these things can be ignored, and I've yet to see any dragon character hated on openly.

I can only hope the zombie/undead things will be banned soon as well. Keep feeding Tef ideas.

 

[Olivia Dem'adas]

3. Yammosks are War Coordinators and have never truly been depicted as having sentience. Even the wiki says they're only partially sentient. They're tools, used by the Yuuzhan Vong. No more.

"This bio-creation was one of the most distinctive creatures within the bestiary of the Yuuzhan Vong Empire. Yuuzhan Vong biotechnology was generally not self-aware, but yammosks were at least partially sentient."

"In addition to forming a friendship with a commander, they were also tended to by a yammosk keeper."

"This provided the yammosk with companionship but was a terrifying experience for the slaves, because the yammosk could mentally manipulate and communicate with them."

-Source

The wiki says that they are 'at least' partially sentient and it is never clarified. There are a few items in the wiki that would imply that they are either sentient are really darn close to it, but I can agree with the general theology that "It doesn't say that they are, so I can argue that they are not." But really, if anything on this list of banned species deserves the sentient status, it would be the 16 meter diameter living brain. To quote movie one, "The ability to speak does not make one intelligent." (or sentient... or whatever he said...)


Again though... I would beg to differ on the opinion that Yammosks are not sentient. And while my portrayal of Dagon the Yammosk was probably a little over the top... I feel that it was appropriate for the character and the species in how I handled him and his abilities, as well as his general outlook on other sentient life and his attempts to protect the 'young ones' that made up the bipedal, organic, sentient species of the Horde.