Using Marketplace Purchases in Submissions

[Valiens Nantaris]

This is a reminder for all members using the Codex and Factory that purchases from another company must be verified by them through the marketplace or via RP before it will be accepted in a submission.

For instance, if you were wishing to use another company's equipment for your NPC Unit submission they must have approved your purchase through the marketplace or have an RP where the sale happens.

Using items in a submission which do not belong to you without approval is not allowed.

 

[Popo]

[member="Valiens Nantaris"]
Honestly, for low level things like basic rifles or speeder bikes, it's kind of flattering, but I get where this is coming from. No one wants to see someone using their top tier walkers or ships without approval or a logical way of getting one lol

 

[The Red of Sinner]

[member="Valiens Nantaris"]

If we only bought one of something, then altered it just that one, single item, say a sword, or a set of armor, do we still need permission?

 

[Valiens Nantaris]

[member="Romeo Sin"]
If you've bought it you have permission evidently.

 

[Hailyn]

[member="Valiens Nantaris"]
Aren't open market products already open to the general people? I was under the impression that anything labeled as Open Market generally meant that the person who was submitting it (whether or not they ever started a marketplace thread) was already giving their permission for the general market to purchase/use.

 

[Rusty]

One would assume this is more geared towards potential large scale abuses. For instance, if a particular location is subbed with 300 bazillion guns of a certain sort that the submitter never bothered to purchase, that would be a problem. Even if the item in question is Open Market, that's not the same as being available to the general public. There's a world of difference between a Star Destroyer that's available to anyone and being able to afford it.

 

[Valiens Nantaris]

[member="Braith Achlys"]
That depends on the creator of the open market sub. It's their choice.

Usually people want to be informed.

 

[Hailyn]

There's a world of difference between a Star Destroyer that's available to anyone and being able to afford it.

That's a very different case from the normal submission of armors, guns, and so on in the factory. Nearly every armor that goes through the factory uses different equipment that were made by other people, if they aren't canon, and this announcement would mean they need to have this proof of purchase for each submission (or a development thread). I'm just saying this is news to me.

 

[Jsc]

[member="Braith Achlys"] - Many of subs are labeled 'Open Market'. I used that prefix with the understanding that my permission was not needed. However, what I learned from this posting is that I was apparently mistaken. My permission is needed apparently. So now I must accept the fact that I need to do one of three things,

• 1. Create a Marketplace listing for my 'Open Market' items. (nope)
• 2. Accept the fact that people must now RP with me in order to purchase these items. (meh)
• 3. Request that the Factory create a new prefix labeled, 'Open Market - Permission Given - Go Nuts'. Which. Is what I would have selected the first time anyway. (yes plz)

 

[Julius Sedaire]

Personally, I think it is a more varied and nuanced issue than whether it says 'Open Market' or not. Just me though. If it says 'Open Market' that doesn't mean the company WILL sell to anyone at any time without refusal or the controller saying so. It just means it CAN be treated as such. To assume that because I want anyone to be ABLE to buy it, so I label it 'Open Market' and yet can't tell someone 'No' with my work is ludicrous. If that is the case, why bother to punish plagiarism in the Factory? Because they don't need to copy and paste my sub, they can just pick whatever they want without my say so anyway, just because I didn't want to pick a Faction/Group specific designation.

'Open Market' doesn't mean anyone for any reason. Nor does even saying 'Faction Specific - Mandalorians/Jedi Order/Whatever' mean anyone that meets that criteria can have it no matter what. It is merely a target audience. Nothing more, nothing less. People outside it may very well utilize it. And people inside it may not, or may be denied it. And even people you want to not use it can have shell players or allies of theirs obtain it and then trade if off to them to work around things.

'Open Market' It is a base parameter, a marketing demographic if you will, and nothing more. I have never interpreted it as a blanket permission statement, and never will. Nor are any of the products any of my characters or their companies make or sell marketed/made in such views. I spend the time to write the sub, sit through the judgement process, etc.... Then the least you as a writer can do is PM me for permission.. Or Skype... Or respond to my Marketplace... Or even try a thread to contract for it if we're talking more than a personal number of items. Even if it is 'Hey, I know Item X is for Faction Y but I want my guy in Faction Z to have it' I guarantee you I will listen to your idea as to how, and if you come to me with a viable plot to obtain it, I will go to the lengths needed to help make it work ICly.

The main thing here this rule is emphasizing is what MANY rules here state when you boil them down to base, and I think it is silly we have to do addendums and discussion on it/them as they are stupid simple, and it is simply thus: Don't be a dick.

 

[Jsc]

[member="Ostanes"]

• 1. After reading that post I came to the conclusion that I obviously missed something behind the scenes here.
• 2. I'm pretty sure that 'Open Market' still means, 'you need my permission for purchases'.
• 3. I'm pretty sure nobody is arguing against that. (in this thread)
• 4. I'm pretty sure I used the words 'new prefix'. Not 'replace prefix' or 'grandfather prefix'.
• 5. I'm pretty sure I used the word 'prefix' incorrectly.
• 6. Your paragraphs also read as, "I'm really tired". Again.

& I like numbers. The end.

EDIT: Ah. Nevermind. I see. The good old "Current Business Owner VS: Subs Original Owner = Who's consent is required for Open Market items", argument.

 

[Valiens Nantaris]

It's quite simple. If you're happy for anyone to use the item you can make a note that no permission is required.

Otherwise, it's always wise to make sure the other person is on board with what you're doing, in case they're not OK with it.

 

[Jsc]

It's quite simple. If you're happy for anyone to use the item you can make a note that no permission is required.

Can I get that clarification noted on the Templates for 'Open Market'? Because I believe that information is not currently self evident to anybody outside this conversation.


EDIT: Actually. This would go great in the Codex/Factory rules listing in the Banner between #5 and #6. Such as,

"6. Using items in a submission which do not belong to you without approval is not allowed. Open Market items may be notated by their to author to include: No Permission Required."

Actually, let's try that again for better specificity...

"6. Using items in a submission which do not belong to you without approval is not allowed. Items may be marked by their current provider to include: No permission required."

 

[Julius Sedaire]

[member="Jay Scott Clark"] - Your edit caught *Exactly* what I meant actually. I've had people tell me, with AEI products and Ostanes, i'm being unfair to decline sale to them because the item says Open Market, and therefore this means anyone is allowed to buy it and I can't say no. When I persisted in my stance, those people tried the 'Well you werent the person who submitted it, ill just ask them'... Or they implied they had an arrangement with the prior owner I didnt know about.

The accusation stood as me playing with favoritism or elitism by saying no to them. The reality was the character was poorer than [member="Corvus Raaf"] after all her 'bills' are paid and a run to the store for wine ensues, or just simply wasn't liked by Ostanes ICly or any number of things.

Your suggestion of a rules clarification/addendum, while sad that it is needed, should succinctly close that ludicrous gap some people seem to think exists, and quash any use of tech the owner of the tech doesn't want, and encourage people to actually roleplay and write out their sneaky acquisitions against the creators will, instead of just poof I have all ur stuff.

EDIT: And yes... I'm on like...... 12 hours of sleep in 3, maybe 4 days now? What of it?

 

[Valiens Nantaris]

[member="Jay Scott Clark"]
Sure, give me a final draft of what you want and I'll take it upstairs.

 

[Julius Sedaire]

[member="Valiens Nantaris"] - I'm hearing a snippet of a Tenacious D song in this... It goes like "That's *^%$in teeeamwooorrrkkk" or some such.

 

[Hailyn]

Why not just change the affiliation of a submission to anything other than Open Market? You can name it Private Market, Select Buyers, etc, etc, etc. The entire purpose of Open Market meant it was open to the free market - it is the purpose of affiliation. If something is affiliated to a faction, everyone in that faction is permitted (because that is the point of affiliation) to use it in RP.

What is the point of affiliation in submissions now?

 

[Jsc]

[member="Valiens Nantaris"]

I'll have something for you by monday and submit it is a 'Suggestion' to Staff in it's own thread regarding the Codex/Factory Rules. Until then I figure the comments posted here will continue to be helpful to the development process.

See ya monday.

[member="Ijaat Akun"]

Yeah. It took me a moment to connect your Alt, with the company, with Rave's status update, with the Marketplace data, with this announcement, and make an educated guess. Sry. I replied way to fast and it bit me in the bum. Oops.

 

[Julius Sedaire]

[member="Jay Scott Clark"] - Don't worry, happens to the best of us. If you need a sounding board for those ideas, since we have some divergent ideas, let me know, i'd be glad to be a sounding board.

 

[Hailyn]

Example of what I mean:

I submit an armor for the Republic (I have actually done this), and totally intend for it to be used by anyone(Yep) - I even tell some friends over skype they can use it (Mhm). But now they want to submit an NPC unit, maybe just one I have no idea, and suddenly need my marketplace thread approval (or development thread) to use it. Because I don't use the marketplace (I don't) often, and don't have a thread for my company there (it isn't required, and I don't really see the need for a tier 1 company to use such), I now need to either contribute to a 10 post thread with them or otherwise tell them that because I don't have the time or willpower to participate in that, they cannot use my armor in a submission.

And what happens if that person, the submitter, becomes inactive? What happens to all of those items then? Are we unable to use them, because of the requirement for permission?