Jedi High Council

[Marek S'hadar]

WAT

 

[Carn Dista]

Not that my opinion is particularly needed, considering you guys have got the the nail on the head pretty much, but heres my thoughts:


11 chairs, not 12.

This way, any decisions made by the council will naturally have a majority vote no, or a majority vote yes. Why is that a good thing? Well think of it this way: If the council is required to make a decision on a subject and they keep butting heads, then theres no way in hell that a decision will be made. A 6 to 5 majority isn't amazing, but it would certainly get things moving, which naturally helps the faction keep a grip on things.



No Knights.

It might seem bias, but look at canon. Anakin was the only knight I can think of that was allowed anywhere near the council, but that was for incredibly political reasons/palpatine doing his thing. Any knights being weighed up for a council position should naturally be weighed up for the position of Master as well, and if they're denied the latter, then they should definitely be denied the former.



No alts.

If you have two or more Jedi characters, only one of them should be allowed on the council at any one time, and their vote in promoting the other character (if such a vote arises) should be considered null and void. The obvious reason for this is shutting down any cries of meta, however it also gives everyone else a fair chance at progression through the order.



Player characters only.

So what if we don't fill all the seats. as the Order expands, so should the council. We could start off with say, five council members, and expand up to seven when the order grows larger, nine when the order grows again, and eleven after that. Conversely, the number of councillors should naturally decrease along with the orders population, to a minimum of three members. This is just to keep things in proportion with the size of the order.




On an unrelated note:

We have no constitution. It might sound like a silly thing to have, but a constitution certainly sets a minimum benchmark/standard in terms of how a council wants their order to operate/act. It also gives the Jedi a sortof handbook as to how they should be conducting themselves in various situations. Seems unnecessary given that the Jedi should already know what to do and what not to do, but without naming names, I've seen some Jedi on here do some wholly unjedilike things that are clearly against every bit of Jedi teaching you can come across. A constitution would allow the council to come down like a rampaging herd of bantha on anyone doing things like that in a much more clearcut way, as they wouldnt have to hunt for specific and possibly vague bits of jedi teachings in order to shut said rulebreaker down.
Thoughts?

 

[Syn]

No alts.
If you have two or more Jedi characters, only one of them should be allowed on the council at any one time, and their vote in promoting the other character (if such a vote arises) should be considered null and void. The obvious reason for this is shutting down any cries of meta, however it also gives everyone else a fair chance at progression through the order.

This I can agree with though as currently it is a council of masters It was deemed those with two (like me) only have one vote in decisions. This includes master promotion votes and council votes.

On an unrelated note:
We have no constitution. It might sound like a silly thing to have, but a constitution certainly sets a minimum benchmark/standard in terms of how a council wants their order to operate/act. It also gives the Jedi a sortof handbook as to how they should be conducting themselves in various situations. Seems unnecessary given that the Jedi should already know what to do and what not to do, but without naming names, I've seen some Jedi on here do some wholly unjedilike things that are clearly against every bit of Jedi teaching you can come across. A constitution would allow the council to come down like a rampaging herd of bantha on anyone doing things like that in a much more clearcut way, as they wouldnt have to hunt for specific and possibly vague bits of jedi teachings in order to shut said rulebreaker down.
Thoughts?

Your always going to have jedi who want to be more proactive compared to the canon. Hell if anything more jedi actually seem to be not doing anything. That attack on coruscant, attack on Tython archives showed how little they are involved in things. Which is not a good thing, sadly war can get them to act, get them to do things. Which going to war is a semi unjedilike solution. Selena in the auction really didn't do anything wrong, she attacked enemies who were stealing jedi artifacts and trying to preserve darkside artifacts and we called her a warmonger for it.

A a master your opinion matters in everything. The order needs guidelines and rules but some (not all) want to roll a jedi who does something. If we followed the meditation and contemplation model wholly it would get really boring for them. Now does that mean it is a bad thing? No just means we got to find that niche for everyone to enjoy themselves.

 

[Soeht]

We have no constitution. It might sound like a silly thing to have, but a constitution certainly sets a minimum benchmark/standard in terms of how a council wants their order to operate/act. It also gives the Jedi a sortof handbook as to how they should be conducting themselves in various situations. Seems unnecessary given that the Jedi should already know what to do and what not to do, but without naming names, I've seen some Jedi on here do some wholly unjedilike things that are clearly against every bit of Jedi teaching you can come across. A constitution would allow the council to come down like a rampaging herd of bantha on anyone doing things like that in a much more clearcut way, as they wouldnt have to hunt for specific and possibly vague bits of jedi teachings in order to shut said rulebreaker down. Thoughts?

As essentially a holy order, the Jedi Order doesn't have a constitution that would be familiar to political bodies. Just as the Catholic Church, the Jedi Order has a set of holy text - or really, just one. The Jedi Code is the foundation of the order and its holy text and the basis for what the Jedi view as what is to be a Jedi and what is not.

Yet, it obviously doesn't cover everything. What I needed then is that a body or group of people becomes the recognized head of the Jedi Order. This is what the High Council and other Councils became. Once the Jedi Order was centralized and moved to Coruscant, it began to structure itself more rigidly. What happened would have been something similar to common law where the High Council and other Councils make decrees and judgements on cases that effectively become law in the Order. This essentially means the High Council is the lawmaker, judge, and jury for the entire Jedi Order.

So for the case of Jedi supposedly acting "unjedilike," such as case is hardly automatic. I imagine even in canon, it was fairly easy for the High Council itself to judge any case of a Jedi Knight needing consideration for exile or punishment.

 

[Soeht]

I added what I wrote about terms in the lead. I welcome any opinions on that.

Now, how are seats not filled by player-characters handled? I suggest just to leave them vacant or have a mute NPC. Carn just suggested to leave them vacant anyway. Any opinions?

 

[Syn]

Mute NPCs would be preferable but we have seen in games, books that in times of war the council isn't always full. Usually it is or tries to be but there have been plenty with less then 12. Leaving them vacant could inspire others who might want to earn a spot and join assuming they don't already have someone on the council as an alt.

 

[Carn Dista]

Theres being proactive, ehich is a good thing for sure, but there's also being unjedilike (drinking, fighting unnecessarily, throwing padawans in the forge , etcetera). The latter is much more of a problem than the former, as it means characters will start to disrespect and eventually disregard the Jedi Order as paragons of good.

I'm not saying that everyone should be super rule followers, but we should all be sticking to the Jedi way. There's not much I can say without naming names, and I certainly don't want to be the person stepping on toes, but there's some stuff that I've seen that just isn't Jedi in the slightest. Yeah, by all means be unorthodox guys, but there has to be a limit enforced by the Jedi Council or we might as well call ourselves Force sensitive mercenaries and do away with the whole guardians of civilisation in the galaxy thing.

 

[Carn Dista]

As for a constitution that wouldn't be recognisable to political bodies, allow me to put one together to show what I mean - its a little difficult to explain without doing a bit of show and tell.

 

[Soeht]

Mute NPCs would be preferable but we have seen in games, books that in times of war the council isn't always full. Usually it is or tries to be but there have been plenty with less then 12. Leaving them vacant could inspire others who might want to earn a spot and join assuming they don't already have someone on the council as an alt.

I've put "Vacant until otherwise in-character" for now. If someone else has an opinion about seats not filled by a player-character, feel free to speak up. I'm just trying to move things along.

Next thing that is important for the entire order is this: the Council's headquarters.

By extension, the High Council's headquarters are the headquarters of the Jedi Order itself. This is what I have stated in the lead:
In canon, the Jedi Order was on the following planets at certain points of time: Tython, Ossus, and Coruscant. Tython was the original homeworld of the Jedi. Yet, they fled that planet after the Force Wars - most likely because the planet is horrible and the war ravaged it further. Ossus was the next homeworld and stayed so until much later in the Order's life. Though, Ossus was more or less the unofficial headquarters. The move to Coruscant was due to the desire to work directly with Republic officials and it also marked the formal creation of the High Council and centralization of the Jedi Order.

The New Jedi Order used Yavin 4, Ossus, Coruscant, along with a starship. Eventually, it settled down on Coruscant as the Old Jedi Order did before, only leaving during the time of Darth Krayt.

Ossus is an unavailable world for the Jedi Order - it is currently in the sphere of influence of the Sith Empire. The Jedi also only temporarily moved back to Tython during the Cold War due to the destruction of their temple on Coruscant and a stipulation that they were not to rebuild it. Seeing the options, I would recommend Temple of Coruscant, which was the standard headquarters of the Old Jedi and New Jedi.

 

[Carn Dista]

Coruscant is always my primary choice in that matter - its the hub of the Republic, and its naturally chock full of routes into the wider galaxy, which is what the Jedi need to get about realistically.

 

[Syn]

Theres being proactive, ehich is a good thing for sure, but there's also being unjedilike (drinking, fighting unnecessarily, throwing padawans in the forge , etcetera).

I must see this forge.

Drinking is hard cause... there never was anything about it being good or bad. Excessive sure that is always bad but I wouldn't want to say no drinking unless there was a clear precedent. As for other unjedilike behavior do speak up if you see it. I will be the first to admit to unjedilike behavior and IC wise I am facing the consequences of it. That actually goes into the headquarters since this character is planet locked unless the rest of the council deems him allowed off world. Invasions/events possibly missions it is allowed but the bulk of time he is confined to Tython because can't go overboard and wouldn't kill the jedi.

The official headquarters of the high council though @[member="Darron Wraith"] might have to clarify because at one point he said we were pulling off of Coruscant or at least not making it the main temple. That would be Tython so the Republics anti jedi sentiment could cool down.

 

[Soeht]

anti jedi sentiment could cool down.

Anti-Jedi sentiment is fairly common, if lore is taken in broad strokes.

 

[Syn]

Yeah I know and in rp terms it gets worse. if the jedi defend people they are warmongers if they do nothing they are cowards and it they try to be proactive they are sith.

 

[Carn Dista]

Hence the idea for a constitution, to try and help define the actions of the Jedi Order and thus decrease said sentiment.

As for pointing out unjedi like behavior, Syn, I'll contact the council about it IC so as to minimize a potential shitstorm of OOC arguments.

 

[Carn Dista]

Also:

http://starwarsrp.net/topic/15844-constitution-of-the-jedi/

Thought it deserved a topic of it's own, because posting it in this thread would severely sideline the current topic IMO.

 

[Soeht]

While waiting for Darron's input on the Council's headquarters, here's the next item:

Appointment of Grand Master.

Most likely by accident, Teferi started a precedent that is grossly against canon and denies the faction (Jedi, really) the ability to choose its own leader by naming Darron as Tef's successor. What I have about the appointment of the spokesperson of the Jedi Order in the lead is the following:
In order to give power to the faction so that it can properly choose its own leader, using something similar the canon method is problem best. In canon, the overall most favored Master of the Jedi Order was nominated. The method of nomination isn't explicit, but a simple vote as soon as there is a vacancy is all that's necessary. Then, the standing Jedi High Council votes on the nominee. The vote must be unanimous - or the position is left vacant.

 

[Carn Dista]

Take a look at my potential constitution @[member="Daella Apparine"] - it covers a section on how MOTO/GM could be put into their positions.

 

[Matsu Ike]

I don't think we even have a favored master.

Carn is new
Darron is best choice but ooc won't allow it
Syn is not a good choice
Matsu is not highly favored
Phylis is getting more active
Kahne has been inactive
Tef well just appeared
Aleidis left the order
Arumi didn't want to join the order but he wanted to help the Republic
Fabula is a groupie
Kiskla is well I got nothing she is here and helpful
Selena is here and has been a councilor in the past
Ben is gone for now
Sky is gone for now

 

[Soeht]

I don't think we even have a favored master.

Don't need one right now. Just need a process to decide on one so it's not in limbo forever.

 

[Carn Dista]

a majority vote from the council for any jedi master character would be a good thing.