Feedback Factionalism & Culture: Do you matter?

[Jsc]

Bias alert: I'm a hard supporter of Major Factions existing to PvP and only to PvP.

That said. Even more clarification incoming. This thread is primarily feedback for me about our sites culture surrounding Major Factions and Site Culture. It's not an arena to debate each other. I, Jay, accept all replies directed at me no matter how phrased, emotional, brief, ranting, or gif filled. Thick skin yo. Homies got it. But be nice to each other like little butterflies, okay. Imagine Srina is sitting on your lap with a plate of Darkside Cookies, reminding you be full of holiday cheer, as you type your replies. It's a pleasant picture. We all agree on that. So reply please. But reply to each other softly. Thanks!

Now. To begin. I've noticed recently that the Map Game strives to fulfill two somewhat separate Star Wars fantasies.

1. Winning
2. Galaxy Defining Story

I say separate. But it's not. Someone winning is definitely story. Our current timeline updates are very much, story by survival. Winning is story. Yes. So when I say, Map Game supports two somewhat separate fantasies. I'm being specific to something else. So play along for a moment and humor me. You'll see where I'm going eventually.

I want to know if you think that factionalism in the Map Game promotes an Us-vs-Them mentality when it comes to writing galaxy defining stories. Do you feel like you need to join a Major Faction in order to make a difference or, to have your character make an impact or, to be remembered by the community at all?

Do you feel forced to participate, just to even matter?

Now. I'm going to cut ahead and answer that with, No. (Again, humor me.) Personally. I think factionalism can make people inclined to believe such things. I think factionalism is by itself a conflict of interest. But, I don't think factionalism itself is what keeps us as a community from writing galaxy defining stories. I think factionalism is fine. When done gentlemanly, ruthlessly, generously, and with good sportsmanship. I think building a game around killing each other is great. But. It can be limiting. If we let it.

So I'm not going to ask you if factionalism promotes good story. It does. I think it does. Winning is story and story can be winning. So, it's fine. The fact that Tef designed Major Factions to kill each other is fine. It's conflict and conflict is good. Even good story.

No. I'm going to skip the title and ask instead,

• Q: Do you feel forced to participate with your characters in the Map Game, just to even matter?
• Q: What alternatives to the Map Game currently cause you to feel that your character matters? On a galactic scale?
• Q: What alternatives do you imagine for your characters mattering? (Ex: Owning a planet maybe?)
• Q: If there was an alternative feature which would cause your character to matter on a galactic scale immediately. (Ex: Owning a planet.) Would you prefer it over participation in the Map Game? Or would pursue neither or both?

Culturally. I want Major Factions to kill each other. Ruthlessly, savagely, gentlemanly, and with a handshake at the end of each and every trillion-body nuclear genocide. I want Major Faction Admins to put generous PvP before creative PvE, every time, and understand that Invasions are life, and that Dominions and Diplomacy suck donkey feet. I do. I'm a believer. I'm biased to the core. But. With territory comes rule and with rule comes politics. Even inter-faction politics. So. Such is life. Oh well. I guess politics can make for good story too. Ask George RR Martin. Lulz. But I also don't want Major Factions to feel like the only way to the top of reputation pile is through The Neverending War and that's it. I want you to matter. No matter what you do on Chaos.

This feedback is focused on Major Factions and Site Culture. Thanks for reading and I look forward to reading your replies. Again, questions in color and let's all remember Srina's caressing touch. Someone will trigger you in this thread. And you will handle it smashingly. XOXO

Thanks.

 

[Takui]

I literally join invasions to ** ** up.

 

[Kitter Bitters]

Q: Do you feel forced to participate with your characters in the Map Game, just to even matter?

My character hasn’t done much in way of invasions and map games and I feel like people barely know they exist.



Q: What alternatives to the Map Game currently cause you to feel that your character matters? On a galactic scale?

honestly I don’t. It’s been fraking HARD to get noticed. The factions are full of fun people doing amazing things but I feel like I dunno what to do to you know do that


Q: What alternatives to the Map Game currently cause you to feel that your character matters? On a galactic scale?

None. But I see people making minor factions and planets. I might give it a shot. I’ve tried making a planet before and that helped a little.

Q: What alternatives do you imagine for your characters mattering? (Ex: Owning a planet maybe?)

I feel like my journalist matters because she draws attention to others so she’s easy to interact with. So maybe a fun job?

Q: If there was an alternative feature which would cause your character to matter on a galactic scale immediately. (Ex: Owning a planet.) Would you prefer it over participation in the Map Game? Or would pursue neither or both?

I'm not sure.

 

[Tefka]

I'm just here to drop one fact - no faction is too big to fail, regardless of anyone's current beliefs.

 

[Junko Ike]

interesting take, I have been in plenty of invasions and seen them change... honestly factions are fun with people who want it to succeed. Major factions can be great but eventually they all rise and fall to be replaced. Minors don't have to be noticed or popular if they want to tell their story.

 

[Ryv]

Q: Do you feel forced to participate with your characters in the Map Game, just to even matter?

A: No. This is a website I write on for fun, nothing here can force me to do anything.

Q: What alternatives to the Map Game currently cause you to feel that your character matters? On a galactic scale?

Typically, I write a lot of Jedi focused threads and take active leadership of a Jedi group in the galaxy. While we do get involved in the map game, I feel like a lot of the threads we write are memorable to me. If you're a Jedi, you've probably seen Ryv around. Might love him, might hate him. Either way, I like that.

Q: What alternatives do you imagine for your characters mattering?

I think a Jedi spacer set up could be fun. Fly around the galaxy, meet random masters, learn all kinds of cool techniques in between explosive adventures.

Q: If there was an alternative feature which would cause your character to matter on a galactic scale immediately. (Ex: Owning a planet.) Would you prefer it over participation in the Map Game? Or would pursue neither or both?

I think owning a planet can make you matter to the map game. NIO and GA both include folks who run their territories in the decisions their factions make during the narrative. I believe the Confederacy has a similar system. Assuming this doesn't matter to the question, I don't think I'd prefer it. I like the idea of going head to head in a competitive environment to prove myself the better. Be it a game or in a story. I'm competitive. Sue me.

 

[Enlil]

• Q: Do you feel forced to participate with your characters in the Map Game, just to even matter?

Nah. But I do it because I get my jollies off PvP.

• Q: What alternatives to the Map Game currently cause you to feel that your character matters? On a galactic scale?

I don't really care about relevancy.

• Q: What alternatives do you imagine for your characters mattering? (Ex: Owning a planet maybe?)

I feel like that's something people get in their head and let rule their perspective. Just write. People will read and if they like it, that's great.

• Q: If there was an alternative feature which would cause your character to matter on a galactic scale immediately. (Ex: Owning a planet.) Would you prefer it over participation in the Map Game? Or would pursue neither or both?

No, because PvP is stellar and not doing PvP is boring a f.

---I do enjoy stories that aren't PvP, but I think that the entire lure of Chaos is its PvP driven Map Game and if you took that away there might be a few people who stayed for the story, but there would be just as many or more who felt like the impetus to remain was gone.

 

[Jacen Nimdok]

Oh yeah, factions definitely create cool stories that you can play with your weird friends. It's just that, like any other medium, there are limitations on the kinds of stories you can tell in a faction.

If you get your jollies from constantly changing the shape of the galaxy, go for it. Me, I tend to find that stuff tiresome after a while. Mostly because the galaxy-changing stuff doesn't necessarily stick in the long run, and anybody can just ignore whatever you did to or on any given planet and continue to do their own thing. Really sucks the tension out of the story knowing that the stakes technically don't matter, IMO.

I mean, that Vong bioshaping technology sure is neat. Annihilation threads won't even matter at the end of the day. Cool!

 

[Ripley Kühn]

I literally join invasions to ** ** up.

big same.


Q: Do you feel forced to participate with your characters in the Map Game, just to even matter?

Nah. I dig participating in the map game, because war is pretty fun, but I don't feel forced.

Q: What alternatives to the Map Game currently cause you to feel that your character matters? On a galactic scale?

I'm not really going for a galactic scale type thing, tbh. I just want to have fun writing my characters. However, I feel like even something as little as private threads can have an impact, especially if you do a lot of them or if they revolve around sensitive topics.

Q: What alternatives do you imagine for your characters mattering? (Ex: Owning a planet maybe?)

Again, I don't really care about my character "mattering". If their story is told how I want it, reputation doesn't really matter, lol. I'm here for writing, not popularity.

Q: If there was an alternative feature which would cause your character to matter on a galactic scale immediately. (Ex: Owning a planet.) Would you prefer it over participation in the Map Game? Or would pursue neither or both?

I JUST LIKE STORIES. That being said, my characters have been involved in warring in the map game for different reasons (and in different ways), and it's a major thing that plays into their development. However, I'm working on writing a new one that doesn't do war, so we'll see how it goes.

 

[Auteme]

Q: Do you feel forced to participate with your characters in the Map Game, just to even matter?

Not really. Though I do feel a mild responsibility as part of GA's staff team, I don't stress too much about spamming doms or invasions. I just like invasions. They fun.

Q: What alternatives to the Map Game currently cause you to feel that your character matters? On a galactic scale?

I don't think any of my characters are close to mattering on a galactic scale, but Auteme is the closest, and I guess she has a few things going on. First is Jedi stuff. I try to be active when it comes to engaging Jedi leadership just like Ryv , though without a fancy title (soontm) Auteme doesn't quite have the same weight -- but it's all about the little things, right? Second is the Senate, though that's partly Jedi stuff too. Auteme represents the NJO in the GA's senate; I assume that counts for something. Third and by far the most important and IC influential is Auteme's relation to the most esteemed and highly-rated holoseries "The Totally Real Adventures of Auteme" (Auteme claims no direct hand in the creation or production of the series). I always get a laugh when people tell me OOC that their characters are definitely fans of the show.

Q: What alternatives do you imagine for your characters mattering? (Ex: Owning a planet maybe?)

I find that the characters who matter most are the ones that are leaders (hot take, I know). Doing something like becoming the leader of a nation or the grandmaster of a Jedi Order would probably make Auteme a lot more cool. Even so -- you also can't really force a character to matter just by giving them a rank. Doubly so, you can't force anyone to acknowledge you. My characters matter because they believe they matter and I believe they matter. Do they matter on a galactic scale? Nope. But they should matter to the people around them.

Q: If there was an alternative feature which would cause your character to matter on a galactic scale immediately. (Ex: Owning a planet.) Would you prefer it over participation in the Map Game? Or would pursue neither or both?

Don't really think instant-mattering on a galactic scale really... works. You can't force people to acknowledge you IC or OOC. If you do your thing and people like the cut of your jib, then maybe you've won. Map Game is fine but it doesn't really matter. If I was writing a character who was shooting for the top in some regard (I am, actually, though he's been quiet for a bit) I probably wouldn't do it by building a major faction and gobbling up territory. Writers > Hexes.

 

[Siobhan Kerrigan]

Q: Do you feel forced to participate with your characters in the Map Game, just to even matter?

No, and what does 'matter' even mean? Whether my characters matter to other people is a matter of indifference to me (much like it doesn't matter whether character X written by writer Y 'matters' to me or not). They matter to me...and at the end of the day I'm here for my personal enjoyment. I have zero attachment to or investment in any major faction ic or ooc. They come and go with varying degrees of success, and I keep doing my thing. My involvement in the 'map game' is limited to joining this invasion or that skirmish when it seems like fun to me.

Frankly, that's really the only reason I 'join' factions. For instance, Elpsis is presently in the GA, but that's purely oocly. Same with Enyo beign in TSE. ICly neither character is a citizen of these nations or attached to them. Dominions bore me. Hell, for Enyo, her whole nihilism when it comes to galactic politics is a big theme for her.

Q: What alternatives to the Map Game currently cause you to feel that your character matters? On a galactic scale?

Again, I don't care about whether other people think my characters 'matter on a galactic scale'. Currently my most in-depth thread is a solo thread for an NPC on a custom planet. It has over 50 thousand words.

Q: What alternatives do you imagine for your characters mattering? (Ex: Owning a planet maybe?) Kinda own some not on the map. Officially that's not recognised oocly by the map game, but that's no problem to me.

Q: If there was an alternative feature which would cause your character to matter on a galactic scale immediately. (Ex: Owning a planet.) Would you prefer it over participation in the Map Game? Or would pursue neither or both?

As already mentioned, this is irrelevant. This whole idea that you need the 'map game' or major factions to 'matter' is absurd and vapid. I can already do everything I wanna do one way or another.

 

[Jsc]

Thanks everybody for all the replies!

Going into this thread I was under the impression that many people felt like, culturally, they had to join a Major Faction to receive the emotional validation they wanted from participating and succeeding on Chaos. However, reading all these replies has reinforced, to me, that everybody has their own bars and goals set for themselves and their own satisfactions for which they strive to achieve on Chaos. Which, is beautiful, healthy, wise, and downright responsible, if I might say so. You all matter. You know you matter. And you how to squeeze from the game exactly what you came here for too. Bravo!

And I think with a community this diverse, and this wise, and this self fulfilling. It doesn't really matter what the impact of the IC galaxy has, or who's the most popular, or who beat who last week. With people this cool. You. You are the reason Chaos is such a fun place to be.

Just you being you.

And again, thanks everybody for all the replies! This changes my perspective on suggestions, feedback, and factions, and I hope it enlightens even more. Happy Holidays and my apologies to Srina. She shouldn't have to sit on anybodies lap or hand out cookies just so we reply graciously to each other. We're all already too cool for that kid stuff anyways.

 

[Kyyrk]

Joke's on you, I gave up on my characters being relevant to anyone besides myself long before joining Chaos.

But seriously though:

• Q: Do you feel forced to participate with your characters in the Map Game, just to even matter?
  • Not in the slightest. I'm only half joking when I say I gave up on being relevant. I write my character for me, and anyone else taking enjoyment out of him is a pleasant surprise.
• Q: What alternatives to the Map Game currently cause you to feel that your character matters? On a galactic scale?
  • Kinda irrelevant, my character isn't supposed to matter on a galactic scale. He's already had his time in the spotlight where galactic scale is concerned. On Chaos he's just another cog in the war machine. The only significant way my character is going to matter to someone else is probably going to be that "Don't make my mistakes" kinda thing. Lots of history, lots of war, lots of choices. Strictly speaking, this character was never supposed to see the light of Chaos. He's already lived his life, and is now thrust into an entirely new life to do it all over again. So why not try and teach others not to make the same mistakes as their ancestors?
• Q: What alternatives do you imagine for your characters mattering? (Ex: Owning a planet maybe?)
  • Frankly? If we're looking at alternatives to the Map Game to make characters relevant to the board story, I'd sooner fix the flaws in the map game before adding something new on top of it.
• Q: If there was an alternative feature which would cause your character to matter on a galactic scale immediately. (Ex: Owning a planet.)Would you prefer it over participation in the Map Game? Or would pursue neither or both?
  • Frankly it depends on what enrichment it offers my character's story. I'm not interested in having my character matter to other writers cause at the end of the day I already know he doesn't. I've spent enough time RPing to know that the average RPer only cares about other characters in the context of how said characters enhance their own characters. So unless this fantastic new galactic relevance does anything to deepen my own interest in my own character, meh.

 

[Okkeus Dainlei]

Q: Do you feel forced to participate with your characters in the Map Game, just to even matter?

• This one is a difficult subject to me. As I will explain in the upcoming questions, "mattering" is something I would like my characters to have. I very much enjoy the Map Game. It is one of my favorite things about Chaos, alongside the Marketplace. Getting involved in it can have my character(s) matter and be a part of the story. So to answer the question, I almost force myself to join just to gain some of that matter.

Q: What alternatives to the Map Game currently cause you to feel that your character matters? On a galactic scale?

• Big, long, important stories. When you hear about people like Ryv and Coren Starchaser , you almost instantly relate them to important and powerful Jedi stories and threads. Getting my character(s) involved in this type of stuff can bring some matter to them. This is becuase usually lots of people see this type of stuff, which can then start to make my character(s) important/relevant.

Q: What alternatives do you imagine for your characters mattering? (Ex: Owning a planet maybe?)

• Have a good space in a MF could help out with this. If almost everyone in the faction knows your character, that is going to help you out. Also writing good and meaningful stories helps with that as well.

Getting a spot on the map does this as well. It is a semi-permanent mark that you left on the site that people will remember.​

Q: If there was an alternative feature which would cause your character to matter on a galactic scale immediately. (Ex: Owning a planet.) Would you prefer it over participation in the Map Game? Or would pursue neither or both?

• I would personally pursue both. If something were to cause that much influence it has to be a good story. But right now the Map Game is the major player in this to gain relevance.

One of my personal goals is to leave a mark here on Chaos. And not by doing something god awful to the board, but something good that people will remember me by. Later on when people go "Hey, you know Okkeus?" my hope is that they will answer with "Ah, yes!" and not "Who is that?"

If I can get people to remember me by something good, it means that I left a positive enough story or experience that they thought to call back to. Knowing that I did that for someone, or multiple people, just makes me know I'm doing something right.

 

[Lirka Ka]

Q: Do you feel forced to participate with your characters in the Map Game, just to even matter?

• Now? Nah. Not at all, I just throw myself at things that look fun and word vomit. But when I started out? Yeah, I absolutely fell into that trap: originally just seemed like a good way to spread around and "show off", and when my LFG attempts garnered just about no attention it did eventually feel like that's all there was. Very dumb, and demoralizing line of thought. I don't recommend it. Pretty much wasted most of my first year on chaos throwing myself at dominions and just solo-writing most of the time, doing nothing of note, and just padding out threads to 50 posts.

Q: What alternatives to the Map Game currently cause you to feel that your character matters? On a galactic scale?

• Is it bad to answer "Nothing lol"? I've always put Lirka up as a particularly loud background character, not much she does particularly matters and most of the meat of this Murder-Elf's story doesn't really involve other people much

Q: What alternatives do you imagine for your characters mattering? (Ex: Owning a planet maybe?)

• In a perfect world? I'd like to turn Lirka into a doomsday cultist that can provide an immediate antagonist for more or less everyone. Albeit, it's not the most practical thing around

Q: If there was an alternative feature which would cause your character to matter on a galactic scale immediately. (Ex: Owning a planet.) Would you prefer it over participation in the Map Game? Or would pursue neither or both?

• Sure? Why not? I think the map game is pretty tiresome (though PvP bonking around in invasions is a blast) and having things that make you "matter" without it sounds pretty epic

 

[Grrwunhoooll Agaburry]

Q: Do you feel forced to participate with your characters in the Map Game, just to even matter?
A: No
Q: What alternatives to the Map Game currently cause you to feel that your character matters? On a galactic scale?
A: My characters dont matter
Q: What alternatives do you imagine for your characters mattering? (Ex: Owning a planet maybe?)
A: N/A
Q: If there was an alternative feature which would cause your character to matter on a galactic scale immediately. (Ex: Owning a planet.) Would you prefer it over participation in the Map Game? Or would pursue neither or both?
A: I wouldn't want my character to matter. I just want to RP how I want with friends. Map game and clout dont matter.

 

[Tathra Khaeus]

Q: Do you feel forced to participate with your characters in the Map Game, just to even matter?
A: Maybe a year ago. But, I write what I write for others as much as myself. The individual characters aren't the focus.

Q: What alternatives to the Map Game currently cause you to feel that your character matters? On a galactic scale?
A: The only thing that ever makes your character matter, other characters and writers. Its nice to have, but still not necessary.

Q: What alternatives do you imagine for your characters mattering? (Ex: Owning a planet maybe?)
A: To matter is subjective. Tathra matters to me, that's as deep as that goes.

Q: If there was an alternative feature which would cause your character to matter on a galactic scale immediately. (Ex: Owning a planet.) Would you prefer it over participation in the Map Game? Or would pursue neither or both?
A: Nah. But whatever tickles someones fancy.

 

[Dasmi Lindervale]

• Q: Do you feel forced to participate with your characters in the Map Game, just to even matter?

Forcing yourself to participate in the map game to matter is like shooting yourself in the foot and then trying to run a race. You're only going to be bitter about feeling forced to participate and ultimately not enjoy writing anything. Others will notice and avoid interacting with you because of this.

I don't feel forced to play the map game, nor do I partake to matter. I want stories that make people think, I want to make a story that makes people feel like they are seeing a world through someone else's eyes.

The map game is fun for giving a particular medium to writing a character to experience settings, but eventually the clouds shift, and places open up.

• Q: What alternatives to the Map Game currently cause you to feel that your character matters? On a galactic scale?

My characters are a drop in the ocean that is Chaos. While possibly not noticed, or spectacular by any means, each of my characters exist and contribute to their own respective stories and groups in their own way. Seeing others be regularly noticed or commented on inspires me to write to their level, not to compare myself to them in a matter of achievements or successes.

• Q: What alternatives do you imagine for your characters mattering? (Ex: Owning a planet maybe?)

My characters exist, and most interact with a particular group. Some even have spread their wings and interacted with more than what is immediately around them, making themselves expand their borders to see the rest of the galaxy. Their stories matter more to me than having a large swath of people recognize my character swung a particular weapon or claimed a certain planet.

• Q: If there was an alternative feature which would cause your character to matter on a galactic scale immediately. (Ex: Owning a planet.) Would you prefer it over participation in the Map Game? Or would pursue neither or both?

I sometimes ponder having a character owning a company or produce something neat that a number of people would hopefully enjoy and want to use. But not for recognition. The map game is for those that enjoy pvp, and I enjoy pvp to some extent.

The galactic scale of notice is not for me, as suddenly I would have the entire galaxy staring at me for one reason or another. Some may enjoy the attention, but for me, I would rather get an honorable mention somewhere on rare occasion for something neat I did.

 

[Serya Talith]

Q: Do you feel forced to participate with your characters in the Map Game, just to even matter?
I have 5 factionless characters that I am writing actively, but truth is you're probably checking to see who's writing this post right now. I scrounge constantly for non-mapgame threads I can bring them all into, but they are feeling rare in comparison unless I want to dance a lot.

Many are left to feel like its mapgame or bust for building stuff on this site. And hey... maybe it is in this current culture.

So forced to participate? No. But does it often feel like the only offered path for making an impact? Yes.

Q: What alternatives to the Map Game currently cause you to feel that your character matters? On a galactic scale?
Be the site you want to see. Make your own stuff. Which is easier said than done. Building something and guiding people can be exhausting, and it takes a certain person to be able to build something past a few threads.

I would love to see minors being more of a thing.

Also- faction wide public threads that break cliques and allow for easy access to all. A little easier said than done. Probs why people aren't pouring effort into it when they already are having enjoyment from the faction threads.

Q: What alternatives do you imagine for your characters mattering? (Ex: Owning a planet maybe?)
Mechanics beyond mapgame affecting things. You've seen the suggestions-- bring back company tiers. Bring back Master vote. Bring back chit you have to work for. I'm not saying its a solution that we all want, but if you look at the question "how can you feel like you matter", the blanket answer is "give me recognition for my effort"

Jend-Ro Quill polls did a really good job of that, I'd say.

Q: If there was an alternative feature which would cause your character to matter on a galactic scale immediately. (Ex: Owning a planet.) Would you prefer it over participation in the Map Game? Or would pursue neither or both?
Probably not, I don't need achievements to feel like I've carved a place out for myself, I just need thread opportunities.

Moar threads pls.