Star Wars Roleplay: Chaos

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Discussion Writing Darksiders

Kitter Bitters

Keeper of Bitter Tales from the Galaxy
Other than a handful of NPCs I have rarely written darksiders. I struggle to come up with reasons somebody would be evil. As I consider new stories I find myself wondering if I should give it a shot?

It just seems like less of the fun slice of life, or nice moments would happen with a bad guy. Maybe I picture it as one dimensional.

What are your tips for writing a darksider? What makes a good villain? What do you like (or not like) to see in a darksider? What even is a Sith? Are there any resources I should read?

Just looking for a fun discussion :)
 
I've always subscribed to the idea that no person is ever born evil or destined for evil, all the things that amount to a character being evil are informed by personal choices, their interactions with others (and what they learn from them), and the environment they exist in. These material conditions all amalgamate into what makes a character good or evil in a moralistic sense, but morality is also malleable between people and cultures. What is evil to the Jedi is good for the Sith, etc.

When I am writing Carnifex, something I always remember is that he is evil because he basically does whatever he wants and has no ethical or moral boundaries limiting his actions. He fully believes that action in itself is self-justifying, that by the sheer act of doing something retroactively justifies it after the fact. This primarily takes the form of murder, destruction, and genocide in Carnifex's case, but in other characters this extends to what can be viewed as charitable or benevolent actions. For Carnifex, morality isn't determined by the nature of an act, but by the success of the will behind it.

He didn't come to this belief overnight of course, it was informed by a very long span of time being immersed in both Sith philosophy and Imperial dogma. Carnifex is a product of his environment. He views the Sith Code as basically an excuse for an individual to indulge in whatever passion they so choose, because by casting aside societal limitations they break the chains that restrain them as a predatory individual.

Idk if this helps at all but I had a desire to ramble.

Kitter Bitters Kitter Bitters
 
I've always believed no one is born evil, when it comes to an evil character things have happened (Nature vs Nurture) to make them the way they are, choices that they've made, events that have happened in their lives, circumstances beyond and within their control and the decisions that they made. Being a product of your environment as well. Especially when it comes to Dark Side users or Sith, they are inherently influenced by their own practices, dogma. I always believe the path of the dark side is a corrupt one, and it can influence who you are the deeper you dive into the pool. Even Prazutis didn't start evil. He was a byproduct of his own environment and upbringing, a long series of events built to eventually turn him into what he is today.
 
In my experience, darksider are either born into it, or broken by what life threw at them.

A darksider can be good, they don't have to have no morals or no cares about what they are doing, what allows them to dig into the dark side is that they are driven by their emotions.

Take Anakin for example, when his mother died he was driven by rage and slaughtered the entire camp of tuskens. He wasn’t evil, he was emotional and his emotion controlled him which over time corrupted him.

I personally think the best sith are those that have fallen overtime, where each torment life has thrown at them has gradually chipped away at their ability to hold boundaries and moral grounds.

Most of my characters are neutral or dark aligned because i enjoy torturing them so much but I also have the best romances and slice of life moments with them because they feel so deeply and are passionate about what they do.

There are so many different types of Darksiders on Chaos. You have the classic evil villains like Darth Carnifex Darth Carnifex and Darth Prazutis Darth Prazutis , you have people like Darth Strosius Darth Strosius who believe their way is the only way, or Madrona A’Mia Madrona A’Mia who is simply put, a psychopath who is only just learning how to feel emotion.

It really does depend on the story you want to tell
 
my view on the Dark Side in Star Wars is that it’s inherently corrupting its practitioners towards evil, and that’s how I tend to write my Dark Siders. the person itself, while they keep pushing boundaries in their acts, most of the time still has some humanity in them. and for me that’s the most interesting part to write, because your character gets to struggle against their own demons, they gets to question their acts and beliefs, suffer in the hollowness of the victory they achieved through the Dark Side, and experience in real time digging the hole deeper and deeper. and this also extend to the slice of life where the character might think at the start that they are doing good for their loved ones, but in actuality they are only dragging them to darkness, and at some point they will realize that they are in a point of no return.
 
I view it not too dissimilar to how I would approach writing any other character.

What is something that makes them interesting as a character and why would others want to interact with them?

Eira is probably the most successful I have been in writing a Sith and the one that I decided to pour more energy into as well since I was really intrigued with the idea that she was an outsider who knew that the life she was raised in was not the life she wanted to live. There was also the sibling tension and the idea that her parents had the perfect representation of their views and morals while Eira was the complete opposite.

While I do agree that no one is born evil, it doesn't take a negative or evil environment for someone to become crazy or capable of committing great evils. And that is something that I desired to explore with Eira.

I also take traits that can be seen as positives, such as ambition, a desire to be seen and respected by others, loyalty and dedication to cause and spin them in slightly or very toxic ways. That way, while she is committing horrendous acts or she is demonstrating cruelty, there are parts of her that others would see as softer and kinder. They just aren't sides of her often seen.

Another important thing is to show the development. Dropping a Sith Lord is fine, but how do you grow as a character from that point and committing genocide or other great acts of evils are all well and good but where is the character moving from that point on? Eira's position allowed for the most growth which is probably why I enjoyed writing her because I am seeing her becoming more twisted but also seeing more of the complexities of her character. She isn't just evil for the sake of being evil.

There are reasons behind her actions, justifications but also at times, an understanding that she doesn't need to justify her acts because she sees others as lesser beings who could not understand her motivations. Which I think is important.
 
A general idea I like to run with is that a "lightsider"/Jedi will be used by The Force while "Darksiders"/Sith use The Force. Choosing to live in disharmony with The Force and currents of the universe. Another thing I think is important to consider is the idea that The Darkside is easier and more seductive but that 'easiness' comes with a great cost.

To me these are just some rudimentary ideas that I try to keep in mind when writing darksiders, and very much just an opinion/two cents on the subject.
 
Firstly, what I will suggest is starting from a point that's familiar to you, and drawing it out to its extremes. Or picking a particular type of darkness and asking yourself what it's the least it would take to get a character to that point, from where they've started.

But aside from that, I do find it worth pointing out that evil comes from more places than just 'the darkside' and 'the Sith'. You may or may not find these avenues easier to get into than the typically more overt evil of the Sith.

Allow you to regale you with my experience, lol.



I wrote Sith for years from the late 90s up until... I wanna say 2017 at the latest. For me that was very much drawing from what I knew at the time. Writing Sith and that darkness came easy, but at some point that resolved for me and it became harder to write. Not because I no longer enjoy the concept of that kind of evil as a genre (I was to somewhat raised on the horror genre and still enjoy it), but it's a heck of a lot more difficult to access now, as creative output. And I think I may have gotten bored with writing it, to some extent.

The kinds of evil I do find easier to access these days are found more in the shades of grey. The less obvious/atypical avenues that don't make use of the darkside or aren't explicitly Sith. Ones that are largely driven by a shared belief between the characters involved.

Belief can be a very strong driver for a character. It drives how characters act and react in many scenarios. Why they believe what they do also matters a great deal, here... maybe something (or several somethings) happened to put them on that path because they weren't resilient enough to weather the trauma (it's worth noting that you don't always need someone to take advantage of your character's weakness or low point. and pull them into the dark; it can happen as a natural outcome of unresolved trauma), maybe they were simply indoctrinated, or they were born into it and raised in it; those are the three most common ways that 'darker' beliefs can happen, here. Some can be simultaneously true for some characters.

But anyway...

Evil driven by beliefs is what I like and have liked about writing:
* Imperial Knights, and Imperialism in general: here the belief can be characterised by the view that both major proponents of the far ends of the Force spectrum (that is, the Jedi and the Sith) are extremists, and in general have failed at bringing a definitive end to the eternal conflict, and therefore, have failed peace. The answer here is effectively peace through ORDER, and that delineates in some rather horrific ways with the lengths its proponents will go to preserve and propagate the Imperial State, but the evil here can also be banal. Many imperial citizens may believe they are serving a good... that's what effective propaganda can do (you've seen Andor, right?). The Force in this case is often seen as a tool, and sometimes, the Force is even seen as property of the State.

* with the Ashlan Crusade for the years that I did: Religious Lightsiders, who saw the lightside as the Goddess Ashla. A faction for whom a core tenet of the founding of the Crusade was the eradication of the Sith, their culture, writings, art, etc. That's genocide in all its forms. There's still Ashlans about, but they are definitely a minority group these days.

* with groups such as the Lightsworn, militaristic lightsiders who have tread along the same lines to the Ashlans, though without the religious component. This one and to some extent the Ashlans tapped into the idea of Jedi Lords/Army of Light.


I also have to say that the 'bright spots' (the downtime, the slice of life, the sweet stuff, the socials) can and do still happen in these scenarios. I've enjoyed them myself.

I hope this helps. :)
 
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Other than a handful of NPCs I have rarely written darksiders. I struggle to come up with reasons somebody would be evil. As I consider new stories I find myself wondering if I should give it a shot?

It just seems like less of the fun slice of life, or nice moments would happen with a bad guy. Maybe I picture it as one dimensional.

What are your tips for writing a darksider? What makes a good villain? What do you like (or not like) to see in a darksider? What even is a Sith? Are there any resources I should read?

Just looking for a fun discussion :)
Honestly, you don't have to do the edgelord evil thing.

I don't have the profile anymore as he died IC, but I wrote a Sith Lord for a hot minute since late 2020 known as Dimitri Voltura if you want to search the name and read up - he started in the old CIS for example. He was a complex character with complex relationships and how he basically died at the hands of a Jedi he actually respected.

Same with Danika Leventis - she's technically still alive, but I bring her back and shelve her again as story allows if you want to search her stuff as well - she cared deeply for the General of her army who was also friend. Just because you are a darksider, doesn't mean that you don't have people you care for and would fight for. Take Anakin for example - love sent him to the darkside. You can also read Simon Meinrad Simon Meinrad and Zhea Nox Zhea Nox 's fight against Kaleb Sunwalker Kaleb Sunwalker in the DE invasion of Coruscant to see this in practice and how a fall can happen for a backstory maybe.

For one - you have more freedom with emotion for example.

I am in my Jedi phase now after having a wealth of fun with my darksiders and though I love my Jedi interactions and things, but sometimes it can feel flat when you write inherently good like I know you do as a Jedi still needs to regulate their emotions to not tip over for example. A darksider doesn't have those constraints. An example here can be Dimitri once again - due to his story over the 4 years I had written him, his death was deeply emotional - not just for me, but everyone that had followed his story during those years and had witnessed the death. Your darksider can be complex and have deep ties that run long past a single faction if you have stories. People come and go but if the character is flexible enough, you can have them adapt to the changes in whatever way you feel.
 
What even is a Sith? Are there any resources I should read?
Most people use the Darth Bane trilogy by Drew Karpyshyn as their best example for what a Sith should act like. Bane is an iconic character, and since we follow his story from beginning to end we get a lot more glimpses into how he thinks and acts than we do, for instance, Palpatine. It also goes into Sith philosophy a bit, so people have picked it up as a guideline for Sith conduct.

In its purest form though a Sith is someone who pursues power by any means necessary. They're selfishness and ambition personified. Everything is a contest of strength, everyone else is their enemy. They'll often have goals and motivations, but fundamentally a Sith succeeds in being Sith when they make decisions that gain them power. The cost of it be damned.

Practically speaking though a Sith is just the person who's always stronger and makes selfish and morally 'bad' choices. Their strength and competence make them effective and their moral corruption turns them into a villain. They're the red lightsaber folks who always want to wipe out the Jedi or steal someone's puppy.

You can play around with ways that humanize a Sith, e.g. a tragic goal (save my loved one), to make them good villains (and, ironically, bad Sith*). Anakin is a good example of that kind of Sith villain. Palpatine is more of the hardline, pure-Sith 'power for power's sake' villain.

It just seems like less of the fun slice of life, or nice moments would happen with a bad guy. Maybe I picture it as one dimensional.
Slice of life, as I understand it, has no stakes. It's difficult to involve a villain in a story without stakes. There's no dramatic tension to play off of.

And the nice moments are also usually reserved for the hero because uplifting stories work better. If Palpatine straight up blasted Luke to death Star Wars probably wouldn't have been a hit. It comes down to 'we don't like bad people succeeding', really.

Most darksiders we see on chaos are usually given three-dimensional personalities that make them relatable to us. Ostensibly they're evil but we get to see the nice moments too because they're humans, too. They're less villains and more morally-compromised protagonists. Anti-heroes with twisted goals, if you will.

But I'm drifting off into literary theory...

What do you like (or not like) to see in a darksider?
A bit of a non-answer, but there isn't really a good one to this. It's whatever you think is coolest. Write your darksider independent of other people's opinions and see if you like it.

I struggle to come up with reasons somebody would be evil.
You know when you're standing in line and someone just cuts in front of you as you're about to order? What if you didn't politely remind them to go to the back of the queue and instead you verbally broke them down emotionally, started throwing hands in a fistfight, and then gloated that they should join your side in a galactic space war after you beat them up?

A short-hand to find reasons to be evil is to find situations where you get wronged and then extrapolate the selfish, worst possible responses. Throw in a dash of selfishness and greed and you're off to the races.

For further reading I'd recommend looking into some archetypes of villains. Shakespeare's a good one to look into for that, he wrote a wide range of villainy.
 
I actually love throwing Mercy into slice-of-life stuff. It lets me explore her character from a different angle. The moments when she is not a psychopathic murderer who goes around breaking things. The tension in that is also pretty nice, especially because you get to write the under-current for yourself. The vibe of 'she is having a good time now, but what if she just snaps? What's keeping her from doing that?'.

I honestly do believe you can take a villain and throw them in any situation. It just takes a bit of flexibility, you need to be willing to stretch their level of comfort too.

What isn't fun is when you throw a villain into a social or a slice-of-life thing and the character overtakes the narrative and makes it all about them.

You gotta make your villain, your evil character, uncomfortable and push their boundaries and see what happens.

That's where you can often find surprising insights, where the character surprises you with something they do or think, that you didn't see coming.
 

Kitter Bitters

Keeper of Bitter Tales from the Galaxy
You know when you're standing in line and someone just cuts in front of you as you're about to order? What if you didn't politely remind them to go to the back of the queue and instead you verbally broke them down emotionally, started throwing hands in a fistfight, and then gloated that they should join your side in a galactic space war after you beat them up?

This made my entire life better LOL
 
What are your tips for writing a darksider? What makes a good villain? What do you like (or not like) to see in a darksider? What even is a Sith? Are there any resources I should read?

This is all just my personal view on how to write dark siders, of course, so grain of salt, but:

Darksiders are pathetic. I don't mean wimpy, I don't mean unimpressive, I mean, like, being a darksider kind of ruins your life.

Generally speaking, people who are comfortable, happy, and well adjusted do not become darksiders. Profound turmoil or profound emptiness are the typical catalysts for indulgence in the Dark Side, because using it makes you feel good and gets you what you want. That it makes you worse in the long run is inconsequential. During that first fall, you probably aren't thinking long term, or you're in so much pain that what happens to you later doesn't matter anymore.

The people who end up snapping and using the Dark under torture or whatever are the lucky ones - if you kill whoever's hurting you, the pain ends, and you have a chance to stop. Prolonged, extended suffering is what most often gets you a long term Dark user. Even when the initial danger is gone - an abusive family, corporate exploitation, imperial repression - you're left with a set of instincts that push you to never feel safe, to never be at ease, and a need to keep up the constant aggression or paranoia or danger-seeking that earned you a modicum of comfort before. Anyone, given the correct series of misfortunes and woes, can end up using the Dark Side.

Being Sith is different.

There are a thousand different Sith ideologies and religions and political movements, but what they all boil down to is:

Power is good. Whatever gets you power is good.

It's good that your family beat you. It's good that czerka nearly worked you to death. It's good that the Imperials destroyed your culture and your home, because now you're strong, and you have power, and now nothing else will ever hurt you again...

Except for yourself, of course, but they don't tell you that during the sales pitch.

Sith are not, by their nature, irredeemable, but to join the Sith is a conscious choice to embrace a self-centered, destructive worldview, and doing that requires abandoning whatever principles or moral beliefs you clung to before - which probably means they've been shattered in your perception already, and you had no one around you to pull you back from the brink.
 

Kitter Bitters

Keeper of Bitter Tales from the Galaxy
Thank you all for the comments! I'm enjoying reading them and I think I've figured out that its Sith in particular I struggle with but I might be able to do a darksider....
 

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