Of old friends....and new beginnings!

[Belizarius Krusi]

"My enclave made us pledged allegiance to the welfare of the people of this galaxy not to a select political body. To be honest I never particularly liked the idea of a Grand Master, temporary leadership might be good for now but my mai concern is that once we get used to having a single leader... we might get too used to having that leader. Personally we should have a Jedi Council without a set leader to head them. It would allow for a more democratic and equal order"

Belizarius was also concerned with checks and balances, a single Grand Master could easily use their authority to only follow their own vision. Belizarius who prefer to only need to follow a unified vision. His old enclave had a single leader and that caused a lot of issues.

 

[The Dark Man]

The Dark Man gave a slight nod of his head in recognition of Karr's words. He took a step back and removed his hands from his hips, cloaked pulled across his torso as he folded his arms across his chest. When Sanya arrived he felt a slight ripple in the Force, an aura that emanated from her. It was almost undetectable, but The Dark Man had spent years mastering the ebb and flow of the Force, such was his skill he could weave matter itself. He pierced the veil and studied Sanya. That ripple, the aura that encompassed her being, it was that of someone who was self-assured, or arrogant. Holier than thou. He slowly peeled his attention away from her and looked to study the other students.

The elderly and enigmatic Jedi Knight grimaced at the words of Avin Starfire, he didn't like the idea of a single leader for the Jedi. It was a well known fact back in the day of the Galactic Republic that The Dark Man had been a hot objector for the woman that held the position of Grandmaster. Too young, too bold, too foolish. He blamed her for many poor decisions and tragic events that would ultimately lead to the victory of the One Sith and fall of the Republic. As Belizarius chirped up The Dark Man gently bobbed his head in agreement, "These Knights speak well, for now we need a temporary leader, a harsh fact, until such a time comes that we can establish a council."

[member="Avin Starfire"] | [member="Kian Karr"] | [member="Sanya Val Swift"] | [member="Belizarius Krusi"]

 

[Kian Karr]

Kian listened to the discussion as those around him talked of the need for a temporary leader to head the Jedi Order. Kian, while understanding the desire, was opposed to the measure and felt the need to make his view clear on this instead of waiting for the thoughts of the others.

"I appreciate the vote of confidence in me," Kian said holding his hands out in front of him, "I truly do."

"However, I am not convinced that measure is necessary." Kian said, not meaning offense and hoping none was taken.

"You see," Kian said, "When I was a padawan there was no Jedi Council and the Jedi of the Galactic Republic were led by a single, powerful Grandmaster."

"I am concerned that if we were to establish a similar set up now, we would be setting up for too much power to be placed in the hands of a single Jedi."

"No one Jedi's vision is perfect....no one way is the proper way to be a Jedi." Kian said looking around at the assembled group, "I would hazard a guess that even among the few in this room, there are different views on how a Jedi should behavior."

"It is for that very reason that a Council is preferred to me." Kian said looking at each of them. "It allows for multiple voices to be heard and viewpoints to be shared."

"I would suggest that rather than adopting a temporary Jedi Grandmaster, we instead establish an informal council of all Masters and Knights to share their viewpoints and address issues that may arise."

"When the ranks of Masters have grown we can then establish a more formal Jedi Council." Kian suggested and then fell silent once more to hear the assembled Jedi's thoughts.

[member="Avin Starfire"] | [member="Kolbacca"] | [member="Tyrena Kaia"] | [member="Tugoro Taidarious"] | [member="Belizarius Krusi"] | [member="Mereel Vaun"] | [member="Inas Reut"] | [member="The Dark Man"] | [member="Sanya Val Swift"]​

 

[Sanya Val Lerium]

[member="Kian Karr"] | [member="Belizarius Krusi"] | [member="Mereel Vaun"] | [member="Avin Starfire"] | [member="Tyrena Kaia"] | [member="The Dark Man"]

Sanya stood there besides kian looking towards the group, her tail flicking and hear ears shifting slightly in the directions of each person who spoke. "I can't deny my roots nor should I. I learnt a great deal of lessons under the Jedi that shaped who I am today. Although Avin..." She said now looking at the Jedi with her orange eyes. "I am in an agreement and disagreement with that statement . While yes kian is a fine leader he makes a much better guide from what I do know of him. The Jedi as been dependent on a soul leader many times and takes away a sense of individuality from a majority." The Kel Dor began to speak again hitting the next point she was about to make almost. "I don't think a single council later on down the line is suitable either. Amusing the republic will expand many worlds will slowly fall under the light of peacekeeping. One group over many worlds is a tough. May I suggest that an area has its own council and the appointed leader of those then make up the main council that bring forward a larger voice. not only that but it brings the advantage that each area can tailor the needs of more future force users."

 

[Tyrena Kaia]

"A council is nice but in meetings, in talks. Having twelve people on one side of a table and having one on the other is a little off putting. It is smart and practical to have someone, appointed to be the voice. We can debate all we want, we can talk for hours to come to a decision but to everyone else. They would prefer one voice to represent the order." She said it looking at KIan and shrugged, she was a padawan and wouldn't mean much but well she was a senators daughter and that meant she did at least know how that game was played and her mother spoke for the many while being only the one.

 

[Kolbacca]

The Wookie stood there spoke up with his robotic voice changer " I do think it best to vote for a few select council members who must have the rank of master as anyone under that rank in my opinion does not have enough experience that also raises the issue on how ranking should work as I have been a Jedi for 78 years and yet to be appointed master because I was a Wookie we have several topics to discuss " he then bowed for speaking out of turn and sat back down.


[member="Kian Karr"] | [member="Avin Starfire"] | [member="Tugoro Taidarious"] | [member="Sanya Val Swift"] |

 

[Mereel Vaun]

Mereel leaned on the tree, listening to the discussion. He didn't have the blade of the order, and he most certainly did not have the experience or wisdom concerning the force that the people around him possessed.

But he was part of this group now, and his input here would affect him in the future. He stopped leaning on the tree and stepped into place at the edge of the group, "I agree with Master Karr. I think we should form a council once we've established ourselves. Even if it would be nicer for government officials to know who they're going to speak to when they contact our Order, we aren't here to serve the whims of the governments or companies around us."

[member="Avin Starfire"] | [member="Kolbacca"] | [member="Tyrena Kaia"] | [member="Sanya Val Swift"] | [member="Kian Karr"] | [member="The Dark Man"] | [member="Belizarius Krusi"] | [member="Inas Reut"] | [member="Tugoro Taidarious"]​

 

[Diysuperguy33]

Lokthra had snuck in just after her majesty Val Swift had entered. Not that anyone had paid particular attention to the 18-year-old. Recalling Sanya's wise helpfulness with an earlier agreement regarding droids; Lokthra had valued all that she said, much the same to everyone else. But an idea that she had been dwelling on since Master Karr had first mentioned a council, could prove to be of value counsel. She stepped forward. As she spoke she looked at the eyes each of the faces before her, so to say she meant business and tell their opinions on her idea.

"What if we had a council of twelve masters to form a grand council; each the leader of their own council, in charge of their respective fields. Each would have personal opinions -- yes. but each would have their respective fields experience, likely able to be more imperative to those in these positions, as opposed to their personal agenda. Education, Admiralty, Army, Exploration, Special Assignment, Medical; these are just a few of the fields. If each is given a fair chance to speak, you should get a much clearer and experience assignment given, as opposed to debating the same issues amongst each other. As for the sparseness of the galaxy; assign a Jedi to maintain each, feedback to a council of its own. Of course, this sounds like a lot of councils, but power would be split very evenly, each would be a speciality in their respective fields, each gets a fair say".

Lokthra bowed and returned to her previous position.

Avin Starfire | Kolbacca | Tyrena Kaia | Sanya Val Swift | Kian Karr | The Dark Man | Belizarius Krusi | Inas Reut | Tugoro Taidarious | [member="Mereel Vaun"]

 

[Avin Starfire]

Nadiem ​

Jedi Enclave​

He nodded in agreement to most of the proposals and counter-arguments being laid out by the other Jedi that had gathered in the Nadiem temple. Furthermore, Avin had expected the backlash towards an autocratic rule yet it had achieved its purpose to kick up discussion and nonetheless shown the opinions of those within the group. Avin waited for the green-skinned Miralian to finish talking before moving himself forward once again.

"My proposal was initially sound but gauging where we are and why we are here my mind has already started to change. The council is a good idea however General Kolbacca makes a strong point as to which hinders any council from forming, at the current we have not more than a handful of masters from the old order if a grand council is to form as put forward by the padawan we do not have the masters to form it as well as running the other departments that need seeing to. However, if this issue was addressed such as in the way of Master Karr's proposal then I believe a council is the best approach."

Avin nodded his respect to the masters before moving back.

He stood awaiting another flurry of replies and opinions as the council started to pick up.

[member="Kolbacca"] | [member="Tyrena Kaia"] | [member="Sanya Val Swift"] | [member="Kian Karr"] | [member="The Dark Man"] | [member="Belizarius Krusi"] | [member="Inas Reut"] | [member="Tugoro Taidarious"] | [member="Mereel Vaun"] l [member="Lokthra Dawning"]

 

[Alexandra Feanor]

Alexandra listened to the others talk, choosing not to say or really do anything. It was the best way for her with this new order and her hand constantly moving in her lap while she sat there. She had been convinced by her companion to not hide this time, that hiding her face was nothing more than rejecting her own decision to better herself. She hated how logical the Ashlan wolf had become since pairing with her many years ago, but now she sat with her eyes cast slightly downwards and simply listening. It was not her place, not yet to suggest a course of action to these Jedi who had spent their lives in the order or devoted their lives to it, she was merely a rogue who had come to join and change who she was. Atleast, change what she was.

Try as anyone might, there was no taking her booze from her.

With her hand other hand holding onto the staff she carried, she found herself listening to each of the ideas. [member="Kian Karr"] brought forth the idea of a council without a grand master and that made her brow raise, that he would even suggest such. It would be interesting to see how that kind of council might exist, due to its unorthodox nature. There was always a central leader to the Jedi as far as she could remember, and even more so in the old texts she had gotten her hands on. She prided herself on that repository of history at her home on Alderaan, something she did not leave unguarded even when away from her home.

Her eyes turned now to the other speakers in turn, listening first to [member="Sanya Val Swift"], who mentioned the use of many councils rather than one. Enclaves had done that in the past of the order, and that was interesting to Alexandra to consider such a path. But such a web would create situations like with that of the padawan massacre on taris during the time of Lucien Draay. While an extreme case, extremism can breed if not quickly weeded out and fracturing the order into cells could create situations like that.

The suggestions after built on the others and Alexandra considered each silently, curious as to how Kian Karr might approach the other ideas. Things were rather curious at the suggestion of the masters of the Grand councils having sub councils run by themselves. It was a bit like a feudal idea of governance within the order that Alexandra found rather intriguing. Though it fell upon a similar issue of loyalty and extremism. She knew what happened when a group within an order became closed off from the other members, soon enough those members step over a line not easily seen.

Her hand stopped as she leaned forward, the small white furred Ashlan wolf perking its head up as it sat next to her. The creature only now becoming distinct from her own tail, its head housing two blue eyes. Her hand ran over to it, patting it on the head while she sat there, curious as to what came next.


[member="Avin Starfire"] [member="Lokthra Dawning"] [member="Mereel Vaun"] [member="Kolbacca"] [member="Tyrena Kaia"]

 

[Kian Karr]

Kian considered the words of the Jedi before him carefully, trying not to allow his own preference or opinion to color his view of their own. Some called into question whether a Jedi Council without a head would be viable, leading to confusion when dealing with Republic officials and others. It was true, that in the least a figurehead was useful as far as interacting with those outside the Jedi Order.

Then there were ideas concerning the size of the council and sub-councils. Kian truly hadn't considered any option like that and he took a moment to allow the thought to pass through his mind, searching for historical examples of it. Certainly some enclaves, such as that on Dantooine in millennia past had established their own councils....but to do so so structurally was certainly unheard of.

"Ultimately," Kian began after a long silence, "the form the council will take will depend on the nature of the Order we envision."

"My vision for the order may be very different than others present." Kian said shruggin, "and I would not want to impose my view on each of you. So perhaps we should discuss, just what we believe the purpose of the Jedi Order of the Republic Remnant should be, as this will aid us in determining the sort of governing body we would want."

"Before sharing mine, however, I do want to stress that there is no voice here that is valued more or less than any other." Kian said glancing among them, making sure to make eye contact with all present and finishing with a glance toward the newest arrival who was stroking the fur of some sort of animal. "Freely share your opinions and your thoughts on this."

"For me," Kian said, "the Jedi Order has always been about finding a balance between serving the Jedi Code and the lightside of the force and serving the interests of the Republic. This will be especially important now that the Jedi have no official role in the Republic Remnant."

"We are all private citizens unless we enlist in the military or are requested to aid in missions." Kian said, wanting this to be clear. "In and of itself, our status as Jedi give us no authority or command. This, some may see as harmful, but I see as freeing the Jedi from obligation to the Republic. We serve the Republic as citizens of the Republic, but we also serve the lightside of the force."

Kian considered this for a moment as he continued. He had thought on this long and hard when he'd first come to the Republic Remnant.

"Generations of Jedi past have had to balance their obligations to the service of the Republic and their obligations to the Jedi Order...." Kian said trying to articulate his thoughts, "and this has likely often come at a cost to some service the Jedi had to offer. In times of peace, this was likely marginal, but in times of war the Jedi, rightly so, focused much of their attention on serving."

"With the separation of the Jedi from the Republic, we can focus on our duties as Jedi. As such, my vision for the Jedi Order of the Republic Remnant is one that focuses on combating the rise of the darkside, on aiding in bringing stability and aid to those who need it, on advancing our knowledge, and on spreading light in the growing darkness."

"It is because of this that I view the duties of the Jedi Council to merely advise and not have a rigid, formal governing body to the order. The Council, in my view, would be here to advise and training Jedi to understand the code and duties of a Jedi. Once this is meet, there will be no need for structure and separate councils elsewhere because Jedi will have the training and knowledge necessary to follow the code and their judgement wherever the force might take them."

Kian finished, realizing he had rambled on a bit. He had tried to articulate his view as best he could.

"But my view of the Jedi," Kian said, putting meaning in his voice, "is not necessarily the proper view....that is why we are having this meeting."

"Thoughts?" Kian asked, looking around the group and clasping his hands behind his back.

[member="Avin Starfire"] | [member="Kolbacca"] | [member="Tyrena Kaia"] | [member="Tugoro Taidarious"] | [member="Belizarius Krusi"] | [member="Mereel Vaun"] | [member="Inas Reut"] | [member="The Dark Man"] | [member="Sanya Val Swift"] | [member="Alexandra Feanor"]​

 

[Avin Starfire]

The Jedi Master [member="Kian Karr"] spoke many words and many of them very wise. The idea of a council was going to be central to the formation of the new order in Avin's mind. After all the Jedi find strength in sticking to rules and having authorities to answer to, without order there is only chaos and with chaos at the least nothing is achieved at the most orders can fall completely and dangerously into passion and the dark side if checks are not in-place especially with the Jedi answering to any military structure by right. The thought made Avin's emotion flare for a moment as his memories of serving alongside republic forces whether Jedi or not had once filled him with pride.

"If I may?" Avin said as he walked forward from the crowd to make contact with the others once more. "As per always Master Karr you speak in great wisdom for an order in which we should all strive towards. However, I fear that such a relaxed attitude to authority and organization is going to hinder us in these most dangerous times."

He turned himself from facing the master to the others standing around. "Again this is but a personal opinion but we have seen the rise of evil in our galaxy and I know we have all felt the shift in the force which is not for the better. I just fear that if we fracture too much within our own organization and break ourselves from Alliance military operations, that we will not be strong enough to win that fight. Master Kian you spoke of combatting darkness. I believe in order to do this it may be integral that we dedicate a sub-section to our combat capabilities in order to allow others to provide the aid and security that the republic needs. A necessary evil if you will."

His tone and volume fell as the no doubt contested topic fell to the side and he stepped back awaiting his idea for a combat arm of the order to be discussed and countered. Debate and council was a good way of pooling ideas and Avin sat awaiting more to come.

[member="Kolbacca"] | [member="Tyrena Kaia"] | [member="Tugoro Taidarious"] | [member="Belizarius Krusi"] | [member="Mereel Vaun"] | [member="Inas Reut"] | [member="The Dark Man"] | [member="Sanya Val Swift"] | [member="Alexandra Feanor"]

 

[Kolbacca]

Thinking and debating in his head he stood up and took a step forward to speak " I find that it would be helpful to have a military there are many dark forces like [member="Avin Starfire"] said we need something to combat this or they will just keep us down, " the Wookie took another thought looking at the peaceful side " I get peace is a good answer and I do not think we need to use our miltary if we make one to show force or to scare but to be used incase of an attack Jedi are becoming rare we need to preserve ourselves or the darkside may very well win " bowing and stepping back to his seat.


[member="Kian Karr"] | [member="Avin Starfire"] | [member="Mereel Vaun"] | [member="Alexandra Feanor"] |

 

[Belizarius Krusi]

"I don't believe Master Karr said that we wouldn't have a sense of uniformity just that we wouldn't have a council or a central figure who could enforce their own dogma on everybody else. If the Jedi learn the code and adhere to our responsibilities then I personally don't see a problem. Everybody is always going to have their own interpretation of that code what's important is that we understand having a different interpretation to just ignoring"

Belizarius started so speak a bit louder

"Look at the Galactic Alliance and Silver Order. They're our allies but they think being a Jedi as a military obligation. We aren't a military, we need to stop automatically dedicating our whole order to a wars which again and again lead to our destruction. How many Jedi have died because military leaders purely want to use our powers for their own benefit, how many people suffer in this galaxy because the Jedi are focused far too much on the larger picture. We shouldn't oblige any of us to assist the Republic, a council shouldn't try to oblige us to automatically assist the Republic on any military endeavor. That should be a choice for the individual Jedi who wish to join the Republic military. I came to this order because I believed that we could be better than what the majority of Jedi are in the galaxy right now"

Belizarius had spent a long time assisting independent worlds that have long been ignored by the 'good guys' of the galaxy. What people need to be reminded of is what the Jedi Order was and what it can be again. It would be pointless for us to just become another Jedi Army to be abused by some master. He had seen the Silver Jedi preach how they're fighting the darkness meanwhile planets just outside their borders live in squalor barely even being visited unless some battle against the other side has to be fought.

"Times are dangerous, you're not wrong in that Master Starfire but if we keep relying on 'necessary evils' every single time that we're threatened then what are we? at that point what is the real reason of being a Jedi?"

[member="Avin Starfire"][member="Kian Karr"][member="Alexandra Feanor"][member="Lokthra Dawning"][member="Mereel Vaun"]@Kolbacca@Tyrena Kaia[member="The Dark Man"]

 

[Belizarius Krusi]

DELETED - Double post

 

[Alexandra Feanor]

Alexandra cleared her throat and raised her hand from the Ashlan wolf to smile at those involved in this meeting. Her hands crossed in her lap as she waited for them to allow for her to speak with undivided attention and soon enough she let the first word leave her lips. It had been a long time since she had taken a role as a master for any order, much less as someone with any sense of standing or responsibility that she had to ensure was not put to shame by her words or actions. This fact did not weaken her voice or her dull her mind, as a velvet like softness accompanied the words in a calm tone that carried over the area.

"If I might be so bold Master [member="Kian Karr"], I have had the opportunity to experience the last thirty years or so from the outside of the Jedi Order, finding myself in need of a balance your past incarnations did not provide... among other reasons. And I have seen what Necessary Evils can do for even the Jedi who stand in the light. It is rather humorous to think one can shut out their basic, human, urges." She had paused when saying human, trying to make it clear she was simply using a phrase, rather than describing a specific species gathered here.

"What I am getting at is rather simple. As a military, the Jedi lead down a path of self destruction, as a peaceful order, the Jedi are lead down the path of stagnation, ending in the corruption and destruction of an order from the inside. No matter what choice you take, you will face hardship and challenges in every direction, it is the fate of the Order as a whole. But with that said, I would like to add this. Any combat focused Jedi Order will be prone to falling if not trained in understanding the difference in the need for more power to protect, and the lust for more power to avenge. Its a slippery slope, knowing why you wish to join a combative group or search for the means to protect those you swore to defend."

With that she stopped and chewed on the inside of her cheek, the woman who looked to be nothing more than a young lady was deep in thought now about how her life had been in her previous form. She did miss the Echani body she once had, but this one was ok. That thought was ended as she started to pat the Ashlan wolf on the head once more, her other hand twisting the hair fibers on her own tail that remained wrapped around her waist.

[member="Avin Starfire"] [member="Lokthra Dawning"] [member="Mereel Vaun"] [member="Kolbacca"] [member="Tyrena Kaia"]

 

[Kian Karr]

Kian listened to the wisdom being shared by those present. This was one of the reasons Kian was not concerned about the lack of a centralized figure or leader....so much wisdom was available in a conclave such as this simply by asking and listening to the advice given. Kian nodded his head as Jedi Knight [member="Belizarius Krusi"] and Master [member="Alexandra Feanor"] spoke of their concerns with the Jedi tied to military service.

"I share these concerns." Kian said folding his arms before him. "In my mind, Jedi are not soldiers. We are not a military force." Kian said, knowing that some might disagree. "Jedi are peacekeepers whose duty first and foremost is to serving the lightside of the force and ensuring that we protect the people of the galaxy."

"That being said," Kian said shrugging apologetically, "I am not so naive as to believe this is achievable with entirely pacifistic methods."

"I am concerned about Jedi serving in the military because I believe it goes against our Orders principles and ultimate goals....but also because I am concerned about what is to happen when the orders of the military are counter to way of the Jedi."

"When that day comes....what is a Jedi to do?" Kian said looking around them. "That being said....I am not opposed to a Jedi who wishes to serve taking up a position within the Republic's military structure."

Kian looked around the group and a smile crossed his face beneath the mask.

"I feel we have been cooped up a bit here." Kian said and turned to lead the group from the enclave. "There is a cavern not far from here where some of the padawans present can gather crystals for their lightsabers if they so wish....and a nice place for the rest of us to continue our discussion and aid them in their journey."

"Any objections to this course of action?" Kian asked. He had been wanting to investigate the caverns for some time and thought now as good a time as any.

​

[member="Avin Starfire"] | [member="Kolbacca"] | [member="Tyrena Kaia"] | [member="Tugoro Taidarious"] | [member="Belizarius Krusi"] | [member="Mereel Vaun"] | [member="Inas Reut"] | [member="The Dark Man"] | [member="Sanya Val Swift"] | [member="Alexandra Feanor"]​

 

[Diysuperguy33]

Lokthra bowed "Lead the way Master"

Thinking as she followed, she believed now was the final opportunity for her voice to be heard in the formation of the Jedi here, ultimately a decision had to be made today, and as humble as she is, she still valued her input into this decision.

"Is it not agreed for the most, amongst all parties here that we would like a grand council to be formed? Is not our decision now, to be what this council does and if others are present? It would be easier for all of us to imagine smaller picture ideas than envision an entire order at once"

"It is also noted that we do not want a council to have all the power, so we are leaning more towards multiple/split purpose so that no matter what happens this Order shall survive from any incursions upon the inside."

Looking at the other Jedi she said through her eyes, that she wanted someone else to bring forth their opinions.

[member="Kian Karr"]

 

[Kian Karr]

It seemed that Kian and his padawan, [member="Lokthra Dawning"], would be heading to the caves alone and he listened to her speak as they walked. She was bringing up the lack of consensus on the subject of Jedi hierarchy. Kian had heard a lot of good ideas and he looked forward to when they could assemble once more and try and establish a plan for the hierarchy. Kian did not like having the weight of the Jedi solely on his shoulders and with the others here now, he no longer had to bear it alone.

"The Council should have little power really." Kian said as they walked. "I have always envisioned it more as an advisory board. Its purpose should be to guide the Jedi and ensure the teachings of the Order are being effectively spread across the Jedi of the Republic."

"What I do not want to see are Jedi so adherent to what the Jedi Council says that they stop trusting their instincts." Kian said as they left the building and approached a land speeder that was prepped for them. "A Jedi on a mission should trust in their instincts and their judgement to decide on the proper course of action. If a mistake is made, the Council should be there to help the Jedi learn from that mistake."

Settling into the speeder, Kian quickly did a rundown of the systems and entered in the coordinates of the cave.

"Care to do the driving?" Kian asked Lokthra smiling beneath his mask.