Flagships

[ADM. Reshmar]

Ok so after talking with alot of people and much deep thought.. lol
I would like to bring up maybe changing the Flagship rules a bit.
With the new Battlecruiser rules a flagship is kinda not worth doing 400 posts for.just look at what a person can get without any development at all in a heavy battle cruiser.

1. Give Minor factions flagships. Make so a minor faction can have 1 flagship up to 1.600 meters. Have it be along the same lines as a normal flagship but fewer posts. Say 3 writers and 150 posts.

2. Give Companies Flagships. Make it so a company can have a flagship 50% bigger than its normal Tier limit. This way a tier 6 company can have a 3km flagship.

3 Make Major Faction Flagships bigger. Lets allow flagships up to 8 km. 400 posts for something 60% more than they get for nothing seems a bit worthless. I would say start at 4km for 200 posts then 100 posts for every 1km over 4km up to a max of 8km

anyway this is just what I wish we could do to make flagships worth developing. As it is not no one will do it because it is not worth the work for what you get compared to a heavy battle cruiser.

 

[Tefka]

1. Nooooooooooo. That will kill the special snowflakeness of staff-ordained flagships. Minor Factions can make cool ships and call them Flagships, but they can't achieve ours.

2. Noooooooooooooooo. Because I hate companies, and I hate this idea. Companies should have to work with factions to make 95% of the ships they produce, and 95% of those ships should be for factions unless that Company also becomes a Faction.

3. I'm down. While we're at it, why don't we double that to anywhere between 2km - 16km. The Executor was 19km. Fudge it.

 

[Tefka]

While we're at revamping Flagships, which is a good idea, why don't we also get rid of the 400 posts base requirement and make the max-requested length of the ship based on 1km / 50 posts in the thread?

100 posts - 2km.

200 posts - 4km

300 posts - 6km

400 posts - 8km

so on and so on, to a max of 16km.

We could even do 1km per / 25 posts if we think it's too difficult for the community, reaching 16km (my proposed max) at the baseline. Flagship threads are inherently boring, anything we could do to spice them up is okay by me.

 

[Allyson Locke]

We're not revamping flagships there's seriously no reason to.

 

[Darth Avida]

1. Give Minor factions flagships. Make so a minor faction can have 1 flagship up to 1.600 meters. Have it be along the same lines as a normal flagship but fewer posts. Say 3 writers and 150 posts.

Please, no. While I'm not horribly fond of the 1km limit, I'd rather not give them a destroyer (and especially not at 150 posts for a ship that a company can make with way less at like 10-20 posts). Minor factions already have plenty going for them.

2. Give Companies Flagships. Make it so a company can have a flagship 50% bigger than its normal Tier limit. This way a tier 6 company can have a 3km flagship.

2. Noooooooooooooooo. Because I hate companies, and I hate this idea. Companies should have to work with factions to make 95% of the ships they produce, and 95% of those ships should be for factions unless that Company also becomes a Faction.

I'd much rather we just adjust the maximum size ship per tier by a small degree. It doesn't need to be big, nor does it actually need to happen, but something that gives them a tiny bit more leeway than what they have. Maybe a 10% increase over-all.

3 Make Major Faction Flagships bigger. Lets allow flagships up to 8 km. 400 posts for something 60% more than they get for nothing seems a bit worthless. I would say start at 4km for 200 posts then 100 posts for every 1km over 4km up to a max of 8km

Dear lord, no. Just make the challenge easier (maybe 300 vs 400) but I am totally not for upping the limit. And I'm doubly not for increasing it 400%, especially not for exactly the same post requirement we have currently for 3km+ ships.

 

[Darth Avida]

With the new Battlecruiser rules a flagship is kinda not worth doing 400 posts for.just look at what a person can get without any development at all in a heavy battle cruiser.

Battlecruisers still require development. Substantial development, at that. I don't see what they're getting for nothing.

 

[Tefka]

We're not revamping flagships there's seriously no reason to.

How many factions own a flagship?

 

[ADM. Reshmar]

per the new weapons exchange you can get a 2810 turbolaser equivilant gun battlecruiser with no development at all. compared to that, what do you get for 400 posts on a flagship? I am just saying no one will do 400 posts for something they can get for free.

I am a ship person. You guys pretty much know that by now lol. fleet people want bigger ships. Heck make them require a tier 5 or above company and a major faction. But a 400 post 5km ship with just a few more guns than a 3km battlecruiser for free is not worth doing.

 

[ADM. Reshmar]

How many factions own a flagship?

None, they are not worth doing with the current rules

 

[Darth Avida]

How many factions own a flagship?

None. Not a single faction has completed the requirements for it, whether it is because of a lack of interest or because of the introduction of the new battlecruiser template that basically makes a flagship only necessary if you want a ship that possesses "all the things" (i.e; maximum hangar, incredible armament & defenses, special features, etc). That doesn't mean there hasn't been attempts, because there were a good handful of flagship threads that were initiated over the course of the flagship template's lifespan from its introduction onward.

I don't quite understand why we're suddenly willing to discuss increasing our maximum allowed ship, major faction-only or not, to 16,000 meters for the exact same requirements we currently have set for a 3,001 meter flagship.

100 posts - 2km.

This is only making it more desirable for larger ships and less desirable for smaller ships. If a group, be it a company or otherwise, wants to make a cruiser of, let's say 1000 meters, they suddenly need to do 40 more posts of development than they did before, all to make it easier for major factions to get their big guns. Flipping the difficulty for higher reward isn't the way to go about this. You're making it disproportionately easier as the ship gets bigger and way harder on the people who submit smaller ships that don't have an interest, or capability, to make larger ships.

per the new weapons exchange you can get a 2810 turbolaser equivilant gun battlecruiser with no development at all. compared to that, what do you get for 400 posts on a flagship? I am just saying no one will do 400 posts for something they can get for free.

I am a ship person. You guys pretty much know that by now lol. fleet people want bigger ships. Heck make them require a tier 5 or above company and a major faction. But a 400 post 5km ship with just a few more guns than a 3km battlecruiser for free is not worth doing.

You're missing the required 30 post development thread for the ship regardless of what is on it. Whether it is completely vanilla or not. The more they put on it the more you should be scrutinizing to ensure they aren't getting away with a ton of stuff that shouldn't be obtainable at that level of development. If we're being too lax, then that is what needs to change.

 

[Allyson Locke]

2. Give Companies Flagships. Make it so a company can have a flagship 50% bigger than its normal Tier limit. This way a tier 6 company can have a 3km flagship.

I really don't see a reason why a company would require the flagship.


Also the 400 post thread is split between writers...heck I've seen some writers write more than that between two people. Its doable just no one ever does it lol.

 

[Raziel]

It genuinely pains me to turn up to a flagship discussion thread and have little more to say on the matter than 'what [member="Tefka"] said'.

I think this would make a point that if you put silly dev into a ship you get a flagship. I'm not a fan of the overpowered minor and mass produced ships we've seen.

100 posts for a 2km flagship feels right. Maybe 100ppsts for a 2km flagship and 25posts/km above this.

Makes a 4km flagship 150 which is fairly achievable and a 16km 450 posts.

That feels about right to me.

 

[Allyson Locke]

[member="Raziel"] [member="Reshmar"]

If this is what you want you two work it out and I'll look it over.

 

[Allyson Locke]

Flagships will remain to Major Factions only. I don't see a reason for a Company or a Minor faction to even have a flagship.

 

[Tefka]

Flagships will remain to Major Factions only. I don't see a reason for a Company or a Minor faction to even have a flagship.

^

You're making it disproportionately easier as the ship gets bigger and way harder on the people who submit smaller ships that don't have an interest, or capability, to make larger ships.

Then put a 'Max Allowed Flagships per Major Faction' in the template. 3 sounds good.

There is no debate to be had about the difficulty or desirability of Flagships. They're not desired and they're too difficult. If you're going to rebut our attempts to solve these problems, provide better solutions.

 

[Darth Avida]

While we're at revamping Flagships, which is a good idea, why don't we also get rid of the 400 posts base requirement and make the max-requested length of the ship based on 1km / 50 posts in the thread?

100 posts - 2km.

200 posts - 4km

300 posts - 6km

400 posts - 8km

so on and so on, to a max of 16km.

We could even do 1km per / 25 posts if we think it's too difficult for the community, reaching 16km (my proposed max) at the baseline. Flagship threads are inherently boring, anything we could do to spice them up is okay by me.

Are we still going to require flagship thread for ships only over 3,000 meters, or will that change? Are development threads involving restricted materials count towards this post count?

 

[Allyson Locke]

Are development threads involving restricted materials count towards this post count?

Restricted materials will be separate from the post count.

Are we still going to require flagship thread for ships only over 3,000 meters, or will that change?

This will probably change, as to how I'm not completely sure.

 

[Raziel]

General Rules

1. An individual character may not own a ship greater than 400 meters in length. Ships over 400 meters must be owned by a Faction (Major or Minor) or Company, and may be captained by the character, but in case of leaving will not go with them without exceptional circumstances and faction administrator approval.

2. Ships and stations at or above 1,000 meters will always require a development thread. Minimum: 10 posts, 1 writer.

3. Ships and stations at or above 1,700 meters will always require a development thread. Minimum: 20 posts, 2 writers.

4. Ships and stations at or above 2,400 meters will always require a development thread. Minimum: 30 posts, 3 writers.

6. Civilian space stations over 3,000 metres will always require a development thread.
Minimum: 30 posts +10 posts for every additional 1,000 meters over 3,000m (Max 10,000m), 3 writers.

5. Flagships always require a significant development thread. See the Flagship rules for full details.
Minimum: 100 posts +25 posts for every additional 1,000 meters over 2,000m (Max 16,000m), 4 writers.


Minor Faction Rules

1. Minor factions are permitted unique, PC-captained ships up to a length of 1,000 meters

Major Faction Rules

1. Major Factions are permitted unique, PC-captained ships up to a length of 3,000 meters.

Company Rules

1. Mass producing any starship will require substantial proof of income by way of development thread, higher tier company, or Minor/Major Faction involvement.
2. To produce a ship over 1,000 meters in length, a company must be Tier 3 or higher.
3. Companies may own and operate a realistic amount of non-combat starships where maximum length per ship = ( Tier Number x 1000 ) / 2
4. Companies may own and operate a realistic amount of combat starships where maximum length per ship = ( Tier Number x 1000 ) / 3 and maximum fleet length = ((Tier Number x 1000) x (Tier Number)) / 2

Flagships

1. Only Major Factions may own Flagships.

2. A Major Faction may only own 3 Flagships

3. Flagships may not be traded between Major Factions

4. Flagships are a prefix located in the Star Wars: Open Role-Playing forum.

5. The requirements of the Flagship thread are as follows:

a. The thread must be a minimum of 100 posts and meet the requires for the size of vessel (see general rules).

b. There must be at least 4 writers actively involved in the thread.

c. The thread is public and is open to any other Major Faction to join.

d. The production - or possession - of the Flagship must be the thread's major focal point.

6. No player may captain a ship over 3,000 meters without the Major Faction Owner's consent.

7. No ship over 3,000 meters will be approved for any Major Faction without a completed Flagship thread.

8. Each Flagship must be labelled Unique.

 

[Raziel]

Proposal above

I added 2 and 3 to flagship rules and I expanded the general rules to include the flagship post count so it's next to the others.

 

[Raziel]

I'm think I might reword 3 to flagships may not change Affiliation.

I don't want people stealing or trading flagships. Those same people that like to play this game can make their bloody own. Likewise I don't want to see a recalled major faction palm them all off to a new faction.