Faction threads being switched over to Dominions at a high post count

[Selena Halcyon]

Some of ya'll are taking this way too seriously. The only situation this where this should ever be a problem is if a faction literally did this to under cut someone else's dominion. As in one faction is kind of plodding along with a dominion and another faction makes a thread on the same planet does their thing then a few posts before they've finished they switch it over. That is the -only- situation in which this should be an issue. There should be absolutely no one complaining about a thread naturally turning into a dominion.

OK let me put it in this light, if i may. Imagine if someone tried to do this with a flagship, it would be underhanded would it not? Take it kind of like that where its just... idk it seems wrong to me in that aspect.

Different because you're literally stealing something. False equivocations are false.

 

[Surge]

[member="Cira"]

I can see why people would do it, but I find it to be a sneaky way of avoiding counter-dominions.

 

[Fabula Caromed]

There are a few things to consider here.

First, this isn't a faction "sneaking [it] in under the radar." Dominions mean literally nothing until they're finished, posted here, reviewed by staff, and approved. However the faction got to the point of adding it to the map update thread, that's when it hits the staff filter. It could be argued that a 99 post "dominion" doesn't deserve that tag until it's finished and posted to the map update thread.

Second, the idea that a thread being switched to a dominion after the fact is somehow underhanded is based on the assumption that this is being used to accomplish something underhanded. There is no theft here, no sabotage, no sucker punch. In a dominion, a world is unclaimed by any other major faction. It's free game. If this was used to suddenly pull out an opposition to another faction who was dominioning the same planet, then there would be that to consider. But that is not what happened. A faction decided that they had put enough work into a thread to make it a dominion.

Third, the idea of "future repercussions." People looooove to talk about "precedent" and "repercussions" when it comes to official staff stances on things. Most of the time, this doesn't come up even once when staff is discussing a rule change. When a problem is found that there is no rule for, a rule is made. No one stops to think "oooh, what are the important ramifications of decisions we've made in the past, and how do they affect this new rule?" It's a new rule for a new situation. We allowed dragons in the past. Then we didn't. No one cared about what kind of "precedent" had been set by allowing dragons before. They had become enough of a problem that something had to be done, so something was done.

This is not being used to set precedent. There are no repercussions or ramifications. This is just an open discussion about something that has already been decided. If, in the future, someone abuses the good faith shown as "precedent" to do something douchey with their own Schrodinger's dominion, a rule will be made. "Precedent" will be ignored, and the abuse will be nipped in the bud.

At this point? Who cares? Let them do their thang. They're not hurting anyone.

 

[Doctor Azure]

The only thing I'm gonna say is that if this is going to happen, it should be within another faction's rights to possibly hijack or counter-dom while it's going on.

 

[Jsc]

Moving forward,

I would enjoy seeing an addition to rules stating that Faction Threads cannot be converted into Dominions. I would also be so specific as to mention that if the word "Dominion" is not located in the title, (not just the tag), that the thread is not a Dominion either.

I would also gives the Primes the planet and say, good job.

 

[Selena Halcyon]

What legitimate reason is there for a thread to not be turned into a dominion if it makes sense to turn it into one? [member="Jay Scott Clark"]

 

[Jsc]

[member="Selena Halcyon"]

Good question.

• I had the thought of "Threads of Convenience" or "Counter Dom Mine". People start picking specific planets to adventure on just in case it could/might/maybe be turned into a Dominion or Counter Dom, eventually. Even weeks down the road.
• Let's say the Faction Thread violates the "Only 20 posts count rule" and suddenly a clean 101 post switch-o-roo becomes a only 40 legitimate posts dom. That's just an afterthought involving bad math, but yeah.

Those were my two musing thoughts. Especially since what Tef presented us with was a very specific scenario and also a admitted oops moment.

 

[Selena Halcyon]

I had the thought of "Threads of Convenience" or "Counter Dom Mine". People start picking specific planets to adventure on just in case it could/might/maybe be turned into a Dominion or Counter Dom, eventually. Even weeks down the road.

What's wrong with that though?

Let's say the Faction Thread violates the "Only 20 posts count rule" and suddenly a clean 101 post switch-o-roo becomes a only 40 legitimate posts dom. That's just an afterthought involving bad math, but yeah.

Honestly I think that at some level this is a little silly. The rule should be handled in way such that 20 posts are the limit that one person can contribute. Essentially 100 posts have to be met by at least 5 people. If one person posts 30 times, then the thread should end up being 110 posts. The fact that it is not already understood and treated this way is just absolutely silly to me and deserves some real discussion as well.

 

[Hailyn]

[member="Selena Halcyon"]

Good question.

• I had the thought of "Threads of Convenience" or "Counter Dom Mine". People start picking specific planets to adventure on just in case it could/might/maybe be turned into a Dominion or Counter Dom, eventually. Even weeks down the road.
• Let's say the Faction Thread violates the "Only 20 posts count rule" and suddenly a clean 101 post switch-o-roo becomes a only 40 legitimate posts dom. That's just an afterthought involving bad math, but yeah.

Those were my two musing thoughts. Especially since what Tef presented us with was a very specific scenario and also a admitted oops moment.

The thread had just reached 50 posts with 6 people contributing when the map was updated and where I was told the planet would be was not where the planet was. The thread was supposed to, when I originally PM'd Anja about it when the planet was approved in the codex if I could use the planet (she subbed it) for my character intro, be a dominion and intro for this character. However, I was assured in the linked screenshot that it was being added to existing faction space (obviously a mistake) so we went with a faction thread after Kyrur left the site and I was left to do it on my own. If I had known the planet was set out of the faction space it would have been a dominion.

So please, everyone who keeps using observations without checking, stop insisting it was some dirty tactic to dominion a planet that is so far from any other faction that there would have been no feasible counter dominion done at all.

And for the record, inviting other factions to speed dominion a world against another is far more dirty and underhanded.

 

[Jsc]

[member="Braith"]

You're golden. My last post was just me musing with Selena about hypotheticals. Happy posting!

[member="Selena Halcyon"]

Nothing wrong. Just me musing about the future.As I was thinking it out I tried to figure out what defines a Dominion and how I could manipulate that into gaining planets faster for a Faction. Open Thread, Faction Thread, Dominion Thread. I decided I could mix them all together if I simply followed the Dominion Rules about Titles. If I included the Faction Name and the Planet's Name? Then I could technically label any and all participates into that thread as simply Faction or Opposition. This would allow all of my Open or Faction threads on specific planets to act as Seeds or Headstarts, in a manner.

Example: Me and Tim go off to the planet next door to fight pirates. We follow the Dom Labeling rules just for fun. "Tim's Faction on Alderaan" we title it. We tag it "Open" or "Faction", even though it's just us two fighting NPCs. We get to twenty posts and call it a day. ...Now. Two weeks later Tim's Faction decides it wants that planet. So I say: "Hey. We followed the Dominion Title Rules over in this old thread of ours. It's sitting at twenty posts. 10 from me and 10 from Tim. So if you would like to start a Dom? Just use that old thread as a headstart towards 100 posts. Easy as pie."

Anyway. That's how I saw myself attempting to exploit the rules as written. Just follow the Dominion Titling Rules with "Faction Name" and "Planet Name", and poof! Everything else can just be labeled "Opposition". Allowing me to convert any old Open or Faction Thread into a Dominion headstart.

So. (Back to square one now) ...How do I counter myself and this brilliant plan!? Mughaha. I do what I suggested in Post #45. I add the necessary words to every Dominion Title of: "Dominion". Not just "Faction Name" and "Planet Name". So now, all of my Seed Threads must be titled as "Tim's Faction Dominion on Alderaan". Which, is surprsingly more potent than my previous: "Tim's Faction on Alderaan". Now I can no longer even begin to pretend it's an Open thread or a Faction thread. Because the title states that it is obliviously a Dominion. And I'm not going to title all of my little adventures into nearby worlds Dominion-this and Dominion-that, just in case it becomes useful later. That's insanity. (Kind of like reading this whole post really...)

___

TL;DR - Jay ponders quote-unquote "exploits" that nobody actually cares about.

 

[Hailyn]

I add the necessary words to every Dominion Title of: "Dominion". Not just "Faction Name" and "Planet Name". So now, all of my Seed Threads must be titled as "Tim's Faction Dominion on Alderaan". Which, is surprsingly more potent than my previous: "Tim's Faction on Alderaan". Now I can no longer even begin to pretend it's an Open thread or a Faction thread. Because the title states that it is obliviously a Dominion. And I'm not going to title all of my little adventures into nearby worlds Dominion-this and Dominion-that, just in case it becomes useful later. That's insanity. (Kind of like reading this whole post really...)

You can rename thread titles, as well as alter prefixes and tags.

 

[Jsc]

You can rename thread titles, as well as alter prefixes and tags.

 

[Doctor Azure]

Wait... 50 posts is only halfway done at the most for a dominion, right? Just make a rule that if a faction thread's going to be switched over into a dominion, it has to be before the 75-post threshold is hit. *shrug*

Also, calling people underhanded for being smart is categorically stupid.

 

[50H31]

I was under the impression that staff reviewed dominions. If they do that, then frankly, if you think you've been smeckledorfed via ninja-dominance, ask a staffer to use some jurisdiction on aforementioned dominion. I don't think we need another rule to establish some kind of specific on a strategic behavior that just flat-out isn't likely to happen.


I know that many folks around here get absolutely livid or very circumspect about the funny blobs on the funny map. But you know what's amazing? People hardly use the planets.


There, I said it. People just don't use most of the planets (except the ones you mine lightsaber-resistant nacho cheese from) that end up in their cloud of influence, and these clouds don't actually have an effect on invasions, as a rule. So, then, let's not assume a crisis here. If you want to move the lines of your temporary blob shape, and feel you've done the things to earn it, talk to a staffer. If you feel someone else didn't and s trying to game the system, talk to a staffer. After all, it's what we (don't) pay them for, right?

 

[Tefka]

Also, calling people underhanded for being smart is categorically stupid.

This quote is "categorically" false.

Actions can be both underhanded and smart. Using multiple adjectives doesn't make one stupid.