Change The SSD/Flagship Requirement

[Ever Dawnracer]

So as it was just clarified, a Dominion must be both started and finished in the same month to count for an SSD/Flagship. Meaning that you can't start a thread the 31st of a month and finish it the next month and have it count. Since we are limited to completing three a month, that basically means that month can't be used for the requirement. Fair enough, but kind of ticky tacky.

Instead, I propose a 30 day requirement. You have 30 days from the beginning of the first dominion to complete three to get the SSD/Flagship. Combined with the three dominion max per month this should work well and bit require factions that want a SSD to wait forever to start a Dominion to count towards their SSD. So you could start one on the 28th of one month, and as long as you complete it and 2 others by the 28th of the next month you'd be fine. Or, for factions who get approved for Major in the middle of the month who immediately start a Dominion, say on the 15th, they'd have until the 15th of the next month to finish 3 for an SSD.

Thoughts?

 

[Teynara Jeralyr]

[member="Ever Dawnracer"]

I don't think it's designed for brand new Major factions, nor for ones that struggle to get their three-a-month in. SSDs are ships that consume vast amounts of time and IC resources - something only the most powerful Major factions will have. It's hardly surprising to observe difficulties in obtaining them, but that's part of the price you for having them.

It's also worth noting: the biggest Major factions tend to be the ones with disciplined leadership, as well as organised and enthusiastic members. They'll plan ahead for their SSD, initiate the Dominions to ensure that they line up appropriately, and therefore achieve their goal. Those are the factions most likely to be able to 'afford' an SSD in the first place.

The current rules, as they stand, are good ones, I think. If your faction can't organise itself to fit three dominions in within a month, they wouldn't meet the requirements anyway, so there'd be little need for the change.

 

[Ever Dawnracer]

[member="Tirdarius"]
Nobody says they can't. But the recent rule clarification screwed up our plans and feels rather arbitrary (no I don't think it was targeted at us, this isn't a vengeance thing). 3 dominions in 30 days is really no different from 3 in month. Same time requirement ( a day less in some months). What it does, though, is mean factions don't have to wait to start a Dominion if they finish three by, say, the middle of the month (it can happen).

Let's say, for example, that the Remnant finishes three by the 20th of the month. They get an SSD, sure, but want another one and the members are eager to get to work on another one. Because of the current rule, they'd have to wait another 10-11 days to start one for it to count. Or, conversely, we finish two by the 20th, start a third, and run into finals week or something (a lot of members are college or high school age) and so we can't finish by the 31st, but we didn't start the first one until the 5th of the month. Why shouldn't we be allowed to count the one westarted the 20th if we finish by the 5th, but not the 31st? It's kind of like punishing people for focusing on school.

Major factions aren't required to have a million members. By your logic, major factions with smaller member bases are more or less undeserving of an SSD? Not every faction has TSE or FO numbers, after all, but we can still control a large enough swath of territory to justify owning an SSD.

Edit: Also I resent the fact that your post insinuates that smaller major factions can't have good leadership and organization. That's crap. We had a plan in place to complete 3 this month. But we started one two days too early and then came a rule clarification which killed our efforts. So, yeah,small factions can be organized too.

 

[Teynara Jeralyr]

[member="Ever Dawnracer"]

As far as I recall, the reasoning behind the rule is that all factions are restricted to 3 Dominions per month, with an extra per mandate. So what they're saying is that a faction must be able to successfully complete their allotted number of Dominions in a month to qualify.

It's not about the thirty days. It's about using your allotted number of Dominions within that space of a month.

A faction that can do that can build an SSD. A faction that can't achieve this will not. It's that simple.

 

[Ever Dawnracer]

What's the difference between a month and 30 days, [member="Tirdarius"]? As far as I know there isn't one. And the change wouldn't negate the 3 per month rule. Just makes things less arbitrary, and more reasonable for smaller major factions, and eliminates the likelihood of waiting.

Why you would argue against the change to a 30 day period rather than a calendar month astounds me. Not like it hurts you. Unless, of course, your trying to keep people down. Or you're scared of us.

 

[Teynara Jeralyr]

[member="Ever Dawnracer"]

'Scared of us'? Give me a break. It's a roleplay forum. Nothing to be scared of.

But there difference is significant: the point of the rule is that it's confined to within a calendar month, during which you're entitled to do three Dominions. If you can do that comfortably, you're entitled to apply for an SSD. If you can't, you're not.

The change you're suggesting would allow you to do three Dominions across two different months, provided the gap isn't longer than thirty days. So, if you decided you wanted an SSD after you'd done your second dominion, hadn't left sufficient time in that month for a third, you'd just be able to wait until the new month rolled around and then use the first dominion of that month as your third of the set. That's finding a little loophole in there.

And you're right: it is discriminating against smaller Major factions, but that's fine. It's not expected that most of the Major Factions would be able to create one anyway. Indeed, having the rule as it is encourages growth in Major factions and gives you something to aspire to and aim for.

Simply making it easier for everyone to have one means you've got little reason to work hard to get the reward. And as far as I know, that's not the point.

 

[Ever Dawnracer]

You wouldn't have to wait until the next month, you'd be able to get it going immediately. Just might not finish it by the 30th or 31st.

A calendar month is 30 or 31 days. This isn't at all a loophole. You still have to complete 3 dominions in 30 days (same amount of time of most calendar months). It's the same accomplishment. Why does it matter if the dominion are completed in two different calendar months if the length of time is the same?

Also, I know you aren't scared of us. You know what I was saying. Your elitism is showing. This is a game, and as has been shown by allowing anyone to start as a Master, everyone shoul be afforded the same possibilities.
[member="Tirdarius"]

 

[Teynara Jeralyr]

[member="Ever Dawnracer"]

That being the case, why not simply wait until the next calendar month? Is it a matter of such urgency? As you say, you have to complete it within the 30 days regardless.

And I'm sorry...it's elitist to argue that there's nothing wrong with the rule as it stands? As you say, it's a game. Games have rules - you can't just change them to suit yourself. Everyone does have the same possibilities - every single faction has to abide by the one-month, three dominion rule. What you're saying is that you'd like to make it easier for the smaller Major factions...but why? The rules are the same for everybody, and one faction has already managed to successfully managed to meet the criteria.

If your faction can't, that's something you need to work on within your faction. It doesn't mean the rules need to be changed to better suit you - because it's already been proven that it can be done.

 

[Ever Dawnracer]

It's not just to suit us. The rule clarification also killed others attempts at getting an SSD (Sovereignty, for example). And as it stands, the rule is detrimental in many situations. I'm just trying to make it better and don't see a reason you should be so adamant against making the rule better without changing the spirit of the rule.

It's not a matter of can't. We will have an SSD at the end of this month. We just have to be unconventional about it and abandon a Dominion until April to do it. Shouldn't have to, though.

[member="Tirdarius"]

 

[Teynara Jeralyr]

[member="Ever Dawnracer"]

I'm not adamant, I just don't think your reasoning is sufficient, tbh. This isn't something every single faction should have. ICly, it's something only a very small number of factions could build and sustain. The rules as is should require a faction to plan carefully and execute their dominions effectively: because doing so shows that they're capable of something that not every faction can do.

The requirements for all are the same, and any faction can step up to achieve that. Whether they can is for them to decide, naturally, but those that can shall reap the rewards. Those that can't can keep working on it until they can. It's incentive to step up their game. Making the game easier only proves they can't do it without such a change. I'd rather see the factions push themselves to accomplish such a thing, personally.

Otherwise you might as well just say "Any faction can have as many SSDs as they want, when they want", and devalue them utterly.

 

[Ever Dawnracer]

Only Major factions can have them. That's as it should be. Any major faction can feasibly have the resources for one.

Your argument that it makes it easier has zero basis. It's still 3 dominions in 30 daysrither way. In my proposal,we don't punish people for starting a Dominion at the end of the month to keep members happy. We don't tell them you can't use it for achieving an SSD if you want. You just have to complete two additional ones within 30 days of starting the first.

My proposal is meant to make it less arbitrary and more practical while keeping the spirit of the rule intact. Means factions don't have to wait to start their next one.

 

[Teynara Jeralyr]

[member="Ever Dawnracer"]

It's not arbitrary: it's completion of your allotted number of dominions in a single calendar month. You only get three, and it's perfectly reasonable to expect you to accomplish them in that period. If you're starting a dominion late in a month and don't leave yourself enough time to complete it within that calendar month, it counts against your dominions for the next month anyway. So, in other words, if you complete two and start one too late to fit into that month, it doesn't count as a dominion for that month, but the next one.

That's your fault, not that of the rules. Like you said: it's down to organisation, and leaving your faction enough time to get the job done within the month. The whole point of the rule is to keep your dominions within the same calendar month.

According to you, your faction is active and organised enough to do this. So what's the problem, exactly? Just do it already.

 

[Ever Dawnracer]

Why should we be punished for trying to stay active? What does that accomplish?

Nothing, as far as I can tell. 3 dominions in a month and 3 in 30 days are the same, you just dont have to do both in the same calendar month. So a faction that goes major on the 15th of a month can complete 3 by the 15th of the next month and get an SSD. How is that so terrible? They're being active and have coordinated 3 dominion in 30 days. That's pretty darn impressive.

 

[Teynara Jeralyr]

[member="Ever Dawnracer"]

That being so, they shouldn't have any trouble achieving it within the next calendar month. If they can't do that, they don't deserve the SSD.

They're not just going to change the rules so you can get hold of your SSD faster. Exercise your patience and continue to prove your activity, as would be expected of a Major Faction. It's pretty much a pre-requisite for a Major that they can generate and maintain strong levels of activity. Keeping the rule as it stands encourages this to continue, because there's a nice shiny benefit if they can.

 

[Ever Dawnracer]

Like I said, we will get one this month. I just don't think people should be penalized for wanting to work ahead. If anything, that shows activity and a desire to progress. The rule as it stands doesn't encourage new factions approved mid month to do anything but sit and wait until the next month. I just don't think people should be punished for wanting to be active.

If you'd, that's fine, and not surprising. I'm don't arguing with you, though.

 

[Chance Bonaventure]

Seems to me to be an ease of judging decision. Far simpler to keep within a monthly timeframe for dom judging, than it is to check calenders and determine if threads started or ended mid months.

We also need to keep judges in mind. They can't be spending a bunch of time chasing down multiple start and finish dates. Far easier to keep monthly times.

Besides, if the focus of a faction is to get an SSD, then that faction will get it done, regardless of timeframe semantics.

 

[Ever Dawnracer]

[member="Sidon Eshe"]
Judges review all dominions anyway. They check completing date. Not hard to also check start date. 15th to 15th. 8th to 8th. Not hard.

 

[Chance Bonaventure]

Just seems to me like a race that has different starting times. Whereas if everyone knows they have the month for the set doms, then everyone knows and the times are set.

Just seems easier, simpler and cleaner to keep monthly dom times.

There's also many options to prepare before a specific month arrives - perhaps even establishing RP or connecting threads for a more interesting or intricate tale.

 

[Ever Dawnracer]

[member="Sidon Eshe"]
There are different starting times anyway. Not like everyone will do it the same month. It can be any month.

The other stuff you mentioned doesn't really matter to the rule change proposal I made.

 

[Darth Carnifex]

If a faction can't complete 3 doms in a single calendar month, then they don't get the SSD.

That failure should urge factions to strive to better themselves to accomplish that lofty goal.